[{"data":1,"prerenderedAt":5455},["ShallowReactive",2],{"header-articles":3,"blog-article-industry-building-trust-and-respect-crucial-convos-for-a-profitable-partnership":1470,"updatesSection-all":4191,"updatesSection-all-team":4767},[4,327,591,907,1148],{"id":5,"title":6,"author":7,"authors":8,"body":10,"caption":7,"category":315,"date":316,"description":317,"extension":318,"img":319,"imgAlt":6,"meta":320,"minutes":321,"navigation":322,"path":323,"seo":324,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":325,"updated":7,"__hash__":326},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fwhy-you-should-monitor-brand-mentions-in-ai-search-results.md","Why You Should Monitor Brand Mentions in AI Search Results",null,[9],"Kerry Guard",{"type":11,"value":12,"toc":290},"minimark",[13,17,20,23,28,31,34,42,45,68,72,80,88,91,95,98,102,105,110,118,124,128,131,156,160,174,178,181,185,188,192,195,199,202,213,217,220,224,227,231,234,238,244,247,250,254],[14,15,16],"p",{},"Right now, AI search engines are talking about your software company. Whether you track it or not, platforms like ChatGPT Search, Perplexity, and Google AI Overviews answer questions every single day about your product capabilities, pricing, and market reputation. B2B software buyers use these tools to build shortlists, compare technical features, and make buying decisions before ever clicking through to a vendor's website.",[14,18,19],{},"If you rely on old brand-monitoring tools, you are running blind. Traditional monitoring platforms track static web pages, social media tags, and news mentions. They cannot show you what a buyer sees inside a conversational AI search box.",[14,21,22],{},"Unlike traditional Google search, where a website's ranking and content stay relatively consistent from day to day, AI-generated responses are dynamic. They synthesize information on the fly from across the web. Without an active monitoring strategy, inaccurate product claims, outdated pricing, or heavy competitor recommendations can quietly slip into AI responses without your knowledge, pulling qualified leads out of your pipeline before you even know they exist.",[24,25,27],"h2",{"id":26},"the-dynamic-reality-of-ai-search-results","The Dynamic Reality of AI Search Results",[14,29,30],{},"To understand why monitoring AI brand mentions requires a new approach, consider how AI search engines differ from traditional search directories.",[14,32,33],{},"In a traditional search model, Google crawls a page, indexes the text, and displays a link. If your page ranks third for a keyword, it generally stays near that spot until an algorithm update or a content change occurs.",[14,35,36,37,41],{},"AI search engines work differently. When a prospective customer prompts an AI tool—asking, for example, ",[38,39,40],"em",{},"\"What are the best enterprise cloud security platforms for healthcare compliance?\"","—the underlying Large Language Model (LLM) retrieves information from dozens of real-time sources, synthesizes the facts, and writes a unique response.",[14,43,44],{},"Because these responses are generated in real time, the way an AI engine describes your brand can shift based on:",[46,47,48,56,62],"ul",{},[49,50,51,55],"li",{},[52,53,54],"strong",{},"New Web Scrapes:"," A fresh review, a Reddit discussion thread, or an updated competitor blog post can instantly alter how the AI summarizes your company.",[49,57,58,61],{},[52,59,60],{},"Prompt Variations:"," Slight changes in how a user words a query can lead the AI to pull from entirely different data sources.",[49,63,64,67],{},[52,65,66],{},"Model Updates:"," As platforms update their underlying LLMs, the sources they trust and cite shift continuously.",[24,69,71],{"id":70},"the-risks-of-unmonitored-ai-brand-mentions","The Risks of Unmonitored AI Brand Mentions",[14,73,74,79],{},[75,76],"img",{"alt":77,"src":78},"","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F378276c5-b933-4eed-8804-a96958aabcdf-why-you-should-monitor-image-1.webp","When you leave your AI presence to chance without monitoring what these engines say, you’re gambling with your brand equity, and small inaccuracies turn into major business risks.",[81,82,84,87],"h3",{"id":83},"_1-hallucinated-features-and-misattributed-limitations",[52,85,86],{},"1. Hallucina","ted Features and Misattributed Limitations",[14,89,90],{},"AI engines occasionally \"hallucinate\": presenting incorrect details with absolute authority. An AI search tool might state that your software lacks a key integration, charges hidden fees, or only supports small businesses when you actually target enterprise accounts. If a buyer reads that hallucinated summary, they may drop your company from their consideration set without ever contacting your sales team.",[81,92,94],{"id":93},"_2-competitor-hijacking","2. Competitor Hijacking",[14,96,97],{},"If your competitors actively optimize their web presence for generative search while your brand stays passive, AI engines will default to recommending your competitors. When buyers ask AI tools to compare your product against a competitor, an unmonitored response might highlight your rival's strengths while summarizing outdated or inaccurate criticisms of your platform.",[81,99,101],{"id":100},"_3-loss-of-narrative-control","3. Loss of Narrative Control",[14,103,104],{},"In B2B tech, your positioning is everything. If an AI search engine pulls its understanding of your brand from outdated PR releases, informal forum threads, or low-authority review sites, your core value proposition gets diluted. You lose control over how your product is framed during the buyer's research phase.",[14,106,107],{},[52,108,109],{},"Expert Insight from MKG Marketing:",[14,111,112,115,116],{},[38,113,114],{},"\"","Designers often say \"This website speaks more to LLMs than human beings.\" To that I say, \"Good. That's step one.\" Step one: be findable by answer engines. Humans will end up there after they search for the problem. Step two: optimize for the human experience once they arrive. Right now most teams are still trying to optimize for both at the same time, which means they optimize for neither.The order matters. Findable first. Usable second.",[38,117,114],{},[14,119,120,121,123],{},"— ",[52,122,9],{},", Founder & CEO at MKG Marketing",[24,125,127],{"id":126},"why-manual-spot-checks-arent-enough","Why Manual Spot-Checks Aren't Enough",[14,129,130],{},"Many marketing teams attempt to solve this problem by occasionally typing their company name into ChatGPT or Perplexity to see what comes up. While spot-checking is a natural first step, it fails as a long-term business strategy for three reasons:",[132,133,134,140,150],"ol",{},[49,135,136,139],{},[52,137,138],{},"Personalized and Location-Based Bias:"," AI search tools tailor responses based on user location, session history, and account settings. What you see on your desktop in an office is rarely identical to what a buyer sees in another region.",[49,141,142,145,146,149],{},[52,143,144],{},"Infinite Query Permutations:"," Buyers don't just type your brand name. They ask complex, long-tail questions like ",[38,147,148],{},"\"How long does it take to implement [Company Name] compared to [Competitor]?\""," Manual checks cannot cover the hundreds of ways prospects ask about your category.",[49,151,152,155],{},[52,153,154],{},"Lack of Historical Tracking:"," Spot-checks give you a single snapshot in time. They don't track trends, measure whether your citation share is growing, or alert you when an inaccurate claim enters the AI's data pool.",[24,157,159],{"id":158},"how-to-build-a-systematic-strategy-the-best-ways-to-monitor-brand-mentions-in-ai-search","How to Build a Systematic Strategy: The Best Ways to Monitor Brand Mentions in AI Search",[14,161,162,165,166,169,170,173],{},[75,163],{"alt":77,"src":164},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F4c47ce7e-784c-46ee-bd33-f4ff8fd72368-why-you-should-monitor-image-2.webp","Protecting your company’s digital footprint requires shifting from manual testing to a structured ",[52,167,168],{},"Search Visibility Optimization (SVO)"," framework. Establishing effective ",[52,171,172],{},"brand monitoring across ai search engines"," involves four operational steps:",[81,175,177],{"id":176},"step-1-identify-high-intent-buyer-prompts","Step 1: Identify High-Intent Buyer Prompts",[14,179,180],{},"Brainstorm the exact questions your ideal prospects ask during their evaluation phase. Move beyond simple brand searches to focus on category comparisons, feature queries, and implementation questions.",[81,182,184],{"id":183},"step-2-map-your-citation-share-across-key-ai-platforms","Step 2: Map Your \"Citation Share\" Across Key AI Platforms",[14,186,187],{},"Track how frequently AI tools cite your site compared to competitors across platforms like ChatGPT Search, Perplexity, and Google AI Overviews. Note which specific URLs the AI uses as references when it mentions your brand.",[81,189,191],{"id":190},"step-3-correct-the-source-data","Step 3: Correct the Source Data",[14,193,194],{},"When you identify inaccurate AI claims, trace where the model pulled the information. AI engines often pull from third-party review sites, developer documentation, or outdated press releases. Updating those primary sources corrects the data that the AI scrapes and cites.",[81,196,198],{"id":197},"step-4-measure-svo-metrics-alongside-traditional-seo","Step 4: Measure SVO Metrics Alongside Traditional SEO",[14,200,201],{},"Expand your reporting dashboard. Along with measuring traditional website traffic and organic keyword rankings, track your brand's citation growth, AI Overview inclusion rate, and direct-traffic conversions.",[14,203,204,205,212],{},"To see how modern search strategies connect directly to pipeline, explore our comprehensive",[206,207,211],"a",{"href":208,"rel":209},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fexpert-digital-marketing-services\u002Fsearch-visibility-optimization\u002F",[210],"nofollow"," Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) services",".",[24,214,216],{"id":215},"supporting-ai-visibility-with-paid-and-analytics-channels","Supporting AI Visibility with Paid and Analytics Channels",[14,218,219],{},"Brand monitoring in AI search provides the insights you need to protect your reputation, but driving consistent revenue requires integrating those insights across your entire marketing stack.",[81,221,223],{"id":222},"reinforcing-visibility-with-targeted-ads","Reinforcing Visibility with Targeted Ads",[14,225,226],{},"When you notice an AI search engine frequently recommending a competitor for a specific high-value query, you can immediately bridge the gap using targeted paid channels. Pairing your organic optimizations with focused digital advertising ensures your software maintains top-of-page visibility while you update and strengthen your organic source content.",[81,228,230],{"id":229},"measuring-real-world-lead-attribution","Measuring Real-World Lead Attribution",[14,232,233],{},"Because buyers often read an AI response and navigate directly to your site later, traditional click-tracking can misattribute those leads as \"Direct\" or \"Organic Brand\" search. Utilizing modern digital analytics allows you to cross-reference offline CRM data, self-reported attribution, and site activity to confirm how AI search visibility influences actual pipeline velocity.",[24,235,237],{"id":236},"summary-protecting-your-brands-digital-reputation","Summary: Protecting Your Brand's Digital Reputation",[14,239,240,243],{},[75,241],{"alt":77,"src":242},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fbfa7aa92-037c-4f2c-8afb-5045bf32ffbc-why-you-should-monitor-image-3.webp","Monitoring your brand in AI search results is no longer optional—it is a critical requirement to protect your reputation, maintain narrative control, and secure your lead pipeline. As conversational engines continue to replace traditional search lists, tech companies that passively ignore their AI mentions risk losing market share to competitors who actively manage their generative presence.",[14,245,246],{},"Establishing a reliable monitoring framework requires dedicated expertise, systematic tracking tools, and continuous iteration.",[14,248,249],{},"At MKG Marketing, we remove the complexity. We provide an experienced, senior-level team that builds and executes your search visibility strategy directly—with no junior handoffs or black-box reporting. We help B2B software and technology companies monitor their digital presence, correct inaccurate AI citations, and convert organic visibility into predictable revenue.",[81,251,253],{"id":252},"protect-and-scale-your-ai-search-visibility","Protect and Scale Your AI Search Visibility",[46,255,256,267,279],{},[49,257,258,261,262,266],{},[52,259,260],{},"Curious how search engines and AI models actually see your brand?"," Our senior-led team breaks down your real-time visibility across AI platforms—no black-box mysteries, just clear data.",[206,263,265],{"href":208,"rel":264},[210]," Explore our Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Services"," or book an initial search strategy review.",[49,268,269,272,273,278],{},[52,270,271],{},"Noticing a sudden shift in your traffic or search presence?"," We’re always down to talk strategy and help you make sense of the noise. ",[206,274,277],{"href":275,"rel":276},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fcontact\u002F",[210],"Contact the MKG Marketing team directly"," to schedule a consultation.",[49,280,281,284,285,212],{},[52,282,283],{},"Want to peek under the hood of machine learning?"," Dive into our guide:",[206,286,289],{"href":287,"rel":288},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-visibility-ranking-factors-2026-how-machines-decide-who-to-quote\u002F",[210]," AI Search Visibility Ranking Factors 2026: How Machines Decide Who to Quote",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":292},2,[293,294,301,302,308,312],{"id":26,"depth":291,"text":27},{"id":70,"depth":291,"text":71,"children":295},[296,299,300],{"id":83,"depth":297,"text":298},3,"1. Hallucinated Features and Misattributed Limitations",{"id":93,"depth":297,"text":94},{"id":100,"depth":297,"text":101},{"id":126,"depth":291,"text":127},{"id":158,"depth":291,"text":159,"children":303},[304,305,306,307],{"id":176,"depth":297,"text":177},{"id":183,"depth":297,"text":184},{"id":190,"depth":297,"text":191},{"id":197,"depth":297,"text":198},{"id":215,"depth":291,"text":216,"children":309},[310,311],{"id":222,"depth":297,"text":223},{"id":229,"depth":297,"text":230},{"id":236,"depth":291,"text":237,"children":313},[314],{"id":252,"depth":297,"text":253},"seo","2026-08-19T16:01:29.475Z","Why track what ChatGPT and Google say about you? Learn why monitoring brand mentions in AI search results is vital to protect your software company's leads.","md","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F3c12c34c-ad32-459d-b38c-32bc49abb722-why-you-should-monitor-hero-image.webp",{},7,true,"\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fwhy-you-should-monitor-brand-mentions-in-ai-search-results",{"title":6,"description":317},"blog\u002Fseo\u002Fwhy-you-should-monitor-brand-mentions-in-ai-search-results","5RVi7PlUuStBs0ZDnG7rVBbJjOT75Yiu-aBaCK1SW5o",{"id":328,"title":329,"author":7,"authors":330,"body":331,"caption":7,"category":315,"date":581,"description":582,"extension":318,"img":583,"imgAlt":584,"meta":585,"minutes":586,"navigation":322,"path":587,"seo":588,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":589,"updated":7,"__hash__":590},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-visibility-ranking-factors-2026-how-machines-decide-who-to-quote.md","AI Search Visibility Ranking Factors 2026 - How Machines Decide Who to Quote",[9],{"type":11,"value":332,"toc":566},[333,336,339,342,346,353,379,386,389,393,396,399,410,414,417,420,440,444,447,450,454,461,464,468,471,475,478,482,487,492,497,501,504,509,512,517,520,525,529,532,535,539],[14,334,335],{},"In 2026, the old playbook for getting found online just doesn't hit the same. Modern B2B buyers aren't scrolling through pages of blue links anymore. Instead, they’re going straight to tools like ChatGPT Search, Perplexity, and Google AI Overviews to compare software features, stack up vendors, and build their shortlists in seconds.",[14,337,338],{},"Here’s the thing: AI engines don’t read websites the way traditional search crawlers used to. Old-school crawlers were all about keyword density, backlink totals, and meta tags to index pages in a directory. But large language models (LLMs) and retrieval-augmented generation (RAG) systems look at the bigger picture. They care about how your information is structured, verified, and contextualized.",[14,340,341],{},"If your tech brand isn't formatted for machine readability, your website essentially becomes invisible to the very engines your buyers rely on every single day.",[24,343,345],{"id":344},"how-ai-search-engines-select-sources-in-2026","How AI Search Engines Select Sources in 2026",[14,347,348,349,352],{},"To understand how your brand gets quoted or recommended by AI, it helps to look at what happens behind the scenes. When a user enters a complex prompt, such as ",[38,350,351],{},"\"What are the top enterprise cybersecurity platforms for multi-cloud compliance?\",","  an AI search engine processes the request through four specific steps:",[132,354,355,361,367,373],{},[49,356,357,360],{},[52,358,359],{},"Deconstructing the Prompt:"," The system breaks the question down to identify the core subject, key concepts, and what the user is actually trying to accomplish.",[49,362,363,366],{},[52,364,365],{},"Retrieving Relevant Data:"," Rather than pulling up a list of web addresses based on exact keywords, the engine searches its database for content that semantically matches those underlying concepts.",[49,368,369,372],{},[52,370,371],{},"Evaluating Content Structure and Source Authority:"," The system analyzes potential sources. It checks whether the text is clearly formatted, whether the facts match other reliable references, and whether the publishing site demonstrates real-world authority on the subject.",[49,374,375,378],{},[52,376,377],{},"Synthesizing the Answer and Linking Sources:"," The engine extracts direct passages from the top-rated sources, writes a unified response, and attaches clickable links so the user can verify where the information came from.",[24,380,382,385],{"id":381},"the-core-2026-ai-search-visibility-ranking-factors",[75,383],{"alt":77,"src":384},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fee360449-da4d-4dfe-a8b0-4ac440db5ad4-ai-visibility-1.png","The Core 2026 AI Search Visibility Ranking Factors",[14,387,388],{},"Based on industry observations and current AI search visibility benchmarks for 2026, AI search algorithms look at six critical factors when deciding which sources deserve a quote:",[81,390,392],{"id":391},"_1-information-gain-and-uniqueness","1. Information Gain and Uniqueness",[14,394,395],{},"AI engines exist to synthesize what's already out there. If your article just repeats the same generic overview that ten other websites published, an LLM has zero reason to cite your brand. Information Gain measures how much new, non-redundant value a page brings to the table.",[14,397,398],{},"To score high here, your content needs:",[46,400,401,404,407],{},[49,402,403],{},"Proprietary research, benchmark surveys, and original data.",[49,405,406],{},"Direct commentary from verified subject matter experts.",[49,408,409],{},"Real-world implementation metrics and detailed technical breakdowns.",[81,411,413],{"id":412},"_2-machine-readable-content-formatting-semantic-chunking","2. Machine-Readable Content Formatting (Semantic Chunking)",[14,415,416],{},"LLMs process web pages in \"chunks\" rather than reading articles sequentially from start to finish. If your key insights are buried inside massive walls of text with generic subheadings, the retrieval model is going to miss the context entirely.",[14,418,419],{},"Winning sites use explicit, machine-readable formatting:",[46,421,422,428,434],{},[49,423,424,427],{},[52,425,426],{},"Question-and-Answer Headers:"," Use direct H2 and H3 subheadings that mirror natural-language user queries.",[49,429,430,433],{},[52,431,432],{},"Bottom-Line-First Declarations:"," State the direct answer or main takeaway in the very first sentence beneath a heading before diving into the details.",[49,435,436,439],{},[52,437,438],{},"Clean Data Tables and Lists:"," Present technical comparisons, feature breakdowns, and numerical data using structured HTML tables and bulleted lists.",[81,441,443],{"id":442},"_3-entity-consistency-and-schema-markup","3. Entity Consistency and Schema Markup",[14,445,446],{},"AI search engines build vast knowledge graphs of \"entities\" (companies, products, executives, and concepts). For an engine to confidently recommend your SaaS platform, it has to verify that your brand is a recognized, trusted entity in your category.",[14,448,449],{},"Implementing detailed JSON-LD Schema markup, including Organization, SoftwareApplication, Article, and FAQPage schemas, gives search engines clear, explicit data about what you offer. When your on-page Schema matches external mentions across review platforms, news outlets, and industry databases, the LLM’s confidence score goes way up.",[81,451,453],{"id":452},"_4-technical-answer-density","4. Technical Answer Density",[14,455,456,457,460],{},"Answer density is all about the concentration of real, factual value relative to your total word count. Unedited AI fluff—filled with generic intros like ",[38,458,459],{},"\"In today's fast-paced digital world...\"","—completely dilutes your message.",[14,462,463],{},"In 2026, AI retrieval systems favor high-density content that delivers precise technical facts, clear definitions, and actionable steps without any extra noise.",[81,465,467],{"id":466},"_5-multi-source-digital-co-citations","5. Multi-Source Digital Co-Citations",[14,469,470],{},"An LLM rarely relies on a single web page to build an answer, it cross-references multiple sources to verify facts. If your platform is mentioned with positive sentiment across third-party review sites, developer forums, PR releases, and partner docs, generative engines see your site as an authoritative industry reference.",[81,472,474],{"id":473},"_6-demonstrable-e-e-a-t-signals","6. Demonstrable E-E-A-T Signals",[14,476,477],{},"Experience, Expertise, Authoritativeness, and Trustworthiness (E-E-A-T) are as foundational as ever. AI engines actively look for proof that a real human with hands-on experience created or reviewed the content. Explicit author bios linked to verified LinkedIn profiles, direct quotes from company leaders, and clear links to primary sources all reinforce your site's trust score.",[14,479,480],{},[52,481,109],{},[14,483,484],{},[38,485,486],{},"\"Understanding these technical AI ranking factors is essential for tech brands today. AI engines don't read content for entertainment—they crawl websites looking for structured facts they can instantly trust and quote. Structuring your site for machine readability isn't just an optimization tactic; it is the only way to protect your digital footprint and ensure your software stays on your buyers' shortlists as traditional search continues to evolve.\"",[14,488,120,489,491],{},[52,490,9],{},", Founder & CEO of MKG Marketing",[14,493,494],{},[75,495],{"alt":77,"src":496},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F76a1ca67-794d-4085-afd3-68d0afbbb963-ai-visibility-2.png",[24,498,500],{"id":499},"combining-technical-ai-formatting-with-a-full-funnel-growth-strategy","Combining Technical AI Formatting with a Full-Funnel Growth Strategy",[14,502,503],{},"Appearing in AI search answers is a critical first step, but visibility alone does not close enterprise software deals. To convert that visibility into actual sales pipeline, tech companies need to connect their organic search efforts with paid channels and accurate tracking.",[14,505,506],{},[52,507,508],{},"Combining Organic and Paid Reach",[14,510,511],{},"When an AI engine routinely quotes your brand as an industry authority, buyers build trust before they ever speak with your sales team. Companies can build on that momentum by pairing organic optimizations with targeted digital advertising. Running paid campaigns aimed at accounts searching for your software category ensures your brand stays visible in both sponsored ads and generated AI responses.",[14,513,514],{},[52,515,516],{},"Tracking Real-World Influence",[14,518,519],{},"Because AI Overviews often answer questions directly on the screen, traditional \"last-click\" measurement tools no longer tell the full story. Using modern digital analytics allows marketing teams to track direct site traffic, self-reported source data, and sales cycle speed. This gives leadership a clear view of how search visibility actually drives revenue.",[14,521,522],{},[75,523],{"alt":77,"src":524},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F221ea7d6-aa63-4d37-a9dd-78f35fdc9bf6-ai-visibility-3.png",[24,526,528],{"id":527},"future-proofing-your-brand-for-ai-search","Future-Proofing Your Brand for AI Search",[14,530,531],{},"Winning visibility in modern AI search comes down to three practical elements: clear site structure, verified real-world expertise, and a consistent presence across the web. As AI tools change how people research software, relying solely on old keyword-stuffing tactics will cause your brand to fall behind.",[14,533,534],{},"At MKG Marketing, we specialize in helping B2B software and cybersecurity organizations navigate these complex search shifts. Our flat, senior-led structure means you work directly with experienced digital strategists, never junior handoffs. We deploy our unified Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) framework to ensure your website is structured for machine readability, citable by leading AI tools, and built to drive qualified sales pipeline.",[81,536,538],{"id":537},"take-control-of-your-ai-search-visibility","Take Control of Your AI Search Visibility",[46,540,541,550,558],{},[49,542,543,544,549],{},"Ready to see how AI search engines view your website? Explore our",[206,545,548],{"href":546,"rel":547},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fexpert-digital-marketing-services\u002F",[210]," Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Services"," or schedule an initial search strategy review with our senior team.",[49,551,552,553,557],{},"Have questions about your site's technical structure or recent traffic changes?",[206,554,556],{"href":275,"rel":555},[210]," Contact MKG Marketing directly"," to speak with a digital search expert.",[49,559,560,561,212],{},"Want to learn more about the shift from traditional SEO to answer engine optimization? Read our guide on",[206,562,565],{"href":563,"rel":564},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-vs-traditional-search-navigating-the-shift-to-search-visibility-optimization-svo\u002F",[210]," AI Search vs Traditional Search: Navigating the Shift to SVO",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":567},[568,569,577,578],{"id":344,"depth":291,"text":345},{"id":381,"depth":291,"text":385,"children":570},[571,572,573,574,575,576],{"id":391,"depth":297,"text":392},{"id":412,"depth":297,"text":413},{"id":442,"depth":297,"text":443},{"id":452,"depth":297,"text":453},{"id":466,"depth":297,"text":467},{"id":473,"depth":297,"text":474},{"id":499,"depth":291,"text":500},{"id":527,"depth":291,"text":528,"children":579},[580],{"id":537,"depth":297,"text":538},"2026-08-11T17:38:25.303Z","How do AI engines choose which websites to quote? Discover the core AI search ranking factors for 2026 and how to get your brand cited.","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Ff37f521d-b3f6-49bb-8b34-f6ddf2fa1770-mkg-blog-ai-search-visibility-ranking-factors.webp","AI Search Visibility Factors 2026",{},6,"\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-visibility-ranking-factors-2026-how-machines-decide-who-to-quote",{"title":329,"description":582},"blog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-visibility-ranking-factors-2026-how-machines-decide-who-to-quote","uugtYiGYIyZuZEQYrtHFmRy06Rx8hcoFT6g3C0eLqW4",{"id":592,"title":593,"author":7,"authors":594,"body":595,"caption":7,"category":315,"date":898,"description":899,"extension":318,"img":900,"imgAlt":901,"meta":902,"minutes":321,"navigation":322,"path":903,"seo":904,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":905,"updated":7,"__hash__":906},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-vs-traditional-search-navigating-the-shift-to-search-visibility-optimization-svo.md","AI Search vs Traditional Search - Navigating the Shift to Search Visibility Optimization (SVO)",[9],{"type":11,"value":596,"toc":878},[597,600,604,607,617,621,624,635,642,646,649,656,663,666,669,672,683,686,691,694,697,702,707,714,717,784,788,791,794,805,809,812,816,819,823,826,830,833,840,843,846,849,853],[14,598,599],{},"For nearly two decades, the digital playbook for B2B software and tech companies was tried and true: pick your keywords, optimize your site, build backlinks, and win the glory of a top ten spot on a page of blue links. Today… not so much. You might notice your organic website traffic dropping even though your keyword rankings haven't changed. The reason isn't that your competitors suddenly bought more backlinks—it is because the fundamental way people look for information has evolved. Users are moving away from traditional engines and turning to conversational models, leaving marketing leaders to navigate the massive operational shift between ai search vs traditional search engines. Fixing this isn't about buying more links; it’s about changing how your website presents information to be indexed by both humans and algorithms.",[24,601,603],{"id":602},"the-core-differences-ten-blue-links-vs-synthesized-answers","The Core Differences: Ten Blue Links vs. Synthesized Answers",[14,605,606],{},"To understand why traditional search engine optimization (SEO) is no longer enough on its own, we have to look at how user behavior and technology have diverged.",[14,608,609,610,613,614,212],{},"When analyzing ai-driven search engines vs traditional search engines differences, the distinction comes down to ",[38,611,612],{},"retrieval"," versus ",[38,615,616],{},"synthesis",[81,618,620],{"id":619},"traditional-search-the-index-and-click-engine","Traditional Search: The Index and Click Engine",[14,622,623],{},"Traditional search engines operate as massive directory indices. A user types a query like \"best enterprise CRM for SaaS,\" and the engine returns pages of indexed links ranked by relevance, domain authority, and technical optimization. The user must then:",[132,625,626,629,632],{},[49,627,628],{},"Click into three to five separate websites.",[49,630,631],{},"Read through intro fluff and sales copy.",[49,633,634],{},"Manually synthesize the data to make a decision.",[14,636,637,638,641],{},"This model relies on driving traffic ",[38,639,640],{},"to"," your website. Your site is the destination where the user finds the answer.",[81,643,645],{"id":644},"ai-search-the-direct-answer-engine","AI Search: The Direct Answer Engine",[14,647,648],{},"AI tools like ChatGPT, Perplexity, Claude, and Google AI Overviews bypass the directory model entirely. They do not just fetch links; they read, cross-reference, and summarize content from across the web into a single, cohesive answer right inside the search interface.",[14,650,651,652,655],{},"When comparing traditional vs ai search results rankings, the target moves from ranking #1 on a keyword list to becoming the primary ",[38,653,654],{},"cited source"," inside an LLM's generated summary. If an AI overview answers your prospect's question completely on the search page, they won't click through to your blog—even if you rank at the top of the organic list.",[24,657,659,662],{"id":658},"why-software-companies-are-losing-traffic-the-zero-click-reality",[75,660],{"alt":77,"src":661},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fa22194a2-19e3-4d2b-a42e-4ad5c6d95b69-click.png","Why Software Companies Are Losing Traffic (The Zero-Click Reality)",[14,664,665],{},"This structural shift explains the mysterious drop in website sessions across B2B software and tech sectors. Buyers are getting their answers without ever visiting your domain.",[14,667,668],{},"When considering ai enterprise search vs traditional enterprise search, enterprise software buyers are no longer hunting through lengthy technical documentation manually. They are asking AI engines to summarize product capabilities, compare pricing structures, and aggregate user reviews into single tables.",[14,670,671],{},"If your marketing strategy relies exclusively on legacy SEO tactics, you face three major risks:",[46,673,674,677,680],{},[49,675,676],{},"Zero-Click Erosion: Higher-funnel informational traffic evaporates as AI Overviews satisfy search intent directly on the results page.",[49,678,679],{},"Loss of Brand Mindshare: If LLMs aren't trained on or citing your content, your product simply doesn't exist during the buyer's initial research phase.",[49,681,682],{},"Vanity Metric Misalignment: Your SEO agency may report stable keyword positions, but your inbound lead forms and phone calls tell a very different story.",[81,684,109],{"id":685},"expert-insight-from-mkg-marketing",[14,687,688,690],{},[38,689,114],{},"AI is making the decision on what it's going to show the user. The system decided your content was the most trustworthy, most citable answer to that exact question for that exact person. Writing something good and checking the ‘helpful content’ boxes doesn't get you there. Those are very different bars.",[14,692,693],{},"‘Helpful’ is table stakes. It's what gets you into the building, not into the room where the AI is assembling its answer.",[14,695,696],{},"What gets you cited is specificity: The right category. Website & Page Structure. Consistent messaging across your entire footprint. A point of view that the model can actually extract and reuse with confidence.",[14,698,699,700],{},"So when Google says ‘just be helpful,’ they're not wrong. They're just leaving out about 80% of what actually matters. And the companies that take that advice at face value are going to watch their visibility collapse while their content quality stays perfectly fine.",[38,701,114],{},[14,703,120,704,706],{},[52,705,9],{},", CEO & Founder of MKG Marketing",[24,708,710,713],{"id":709},"the-evolution-moving-from-seo-to-svo-aeo-and-geo",[75,711],{"alt":77,"src":712},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F4dd65826-2a82-444b-9693-b6845e4438c0-meeting.png","The Evolution: Moving from SEO to SVO, AEO, and GEO",[14,715,716],{},"To stay visible and continue generating qualified pipeline, marketing executives must expand their organic framework beyond traditional boundaries. This requires a modern, multi-layered approach:",[718,719,720,736],"table",{},[721,722,723],"thead",{},[724,725,726,730,733],"tr",{},[727,728,729],"th",{},"Framework",[727,731,732],{},"Full Name",[727,734,735],{},"Primary Objective",[737,738,739,751,762,773],"tbody",{},[724,740,741,745,748],{},[742,743,744],"td",{},"SEO",[742,746,747],{},"Search Engine Optimization",[742,749,750],{},"Ranking pages on traditional search engine results pages (SERPs) for targeted keywords.",[724,752,753,756,759],{},[742,754,755],{},"AEO",[742,757,758],{},"Answer Engine Optimization",[742,760,761],{},"Structuring data so voice assistants and snippet engines can pull direct, succinct answers.",[724,763,764,767,770],{},[742,765,766],{},"GEO",[742,768,769],{},"Generative Engine Optimization",[742,771,772],{},"Formatting brand narrative, statistics, and domain expertise so LLMs ingest and cite your brand.",[724,774,775,778,781],{},[742,776,777],{},"SVO",[742,779,780],{},"Search Visibility Optimization",[742,782,783],{},"The Unified Strategy: Maximizing total brand presence across both traditional links and AI answer engines.",[81,785,787],{"id":786},"how-search-visibility-optimization-svo-solves-the-gap","How Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Solves the Gap",[14,789,790],{},"SVO doesn't discard traditional SEO; it unifies SEO, AEO, and GEO into a single operational framework.",[14,792,793],{},"Rather than chasing raw session counts, SVO focuses on Information Gain and Citations. To win citations in AI-generated answers, your web content must feature:",[132,795,796,799,802],{},[49,797,798],{},"Clear, Schema-Structured Data: Helping bots identify who you are, what your software does, and who you serve without guessing.",[49,800,801],{},"First-Party Expertise (E-E-A-T): Unique data points, proprietary benchmark reports, and expert commentary that LLMs cannot synthesize from generic web text.",[49,803,804],{},"Direct Answer Formatting: Clear, concise definitions at the top of technical pieces that allow answer engines to extract key takeaways cleanly.",[24,806,808],{"id":807},"practical-steps-to-adapt-your-search-strategy-today","Practical Steps to Adapt Your Search Strategy Today",[14,810,811],{},"Shifting your company's digital presence to capture both traditional and AI-driven search doesn't require scrapping your entire content library. It requires restructuring how your information is delivered.",[81,813,815],{"id":814},"_1-optimize-for-high-information-gain","1. Optimize for High Information Gain",[14,817,818],{},"Eliminate generic, top-of-funnel fluff articles that summarize widely available knowledge. AI engines already summarize that data effortlessly. Focus instead on deep, opinionated, original content: teardowns of real customer implementation challenges, original survey data, and niche technical workflows.",[81,820,822],{"id":821},"_2-standardize-entity-and-brand-citations","2. Standardize Entity and Brand Citations",[14,824,825],{},"Ensure your brand's core value proposition, product categories, and technical terminology are consistent across external review sites, Wikipedia entries, PR releases, and your own domain. LLMs establish trust by cross-referencing brand information across multiple authoritative sources.",[81,827,829],{"id":828},"_3-track-pipeline-impact-over-pure-clicks","3. Track Pipeline Impact over Pure Clicks",[14,831,832],{},"Recognize that a drop in informational blog clicks does not automatically mean a drop in revenue. If an AI search tool cites your software as the top recommendation for an enterprise query, the prospect may navigate directly to your pricing or contact page to initiate a call. Measure branded search volume, direct traffic, and pipeline velocity alongside traditional organic metrics.",[24,834,836,839],{"id":835},"summary-adapting-to-how-buyers-search-today",[75,837],{"alt":77,"src":838},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F1a47aa4c-b986-4fd6-b30d-5ff622a02239-brain.png","Summary: Adapting to How Buyers Search Today",[14,841,842],{},"The debate surrounding ai search vs traditional search engines isn't about choosing one platform over the other. Traditional search engines will continue to process billions of queries, but AI-driven answer engines are rapidly capturing high-intent B2B research behavior. If software and tech companies want to keep filling their sales pipelines with new customers, they must adapt to how people search today.",[14,844,845],{},"Succeeding in this new landscape requires a refined strategy, technical precision, and continuous testing across evolving engine algorithms.",[14,847,848],{},"At MKG Marketing, we eliminate the guesswork. We provide a senior-led team of digital experts who handle your search strategy and technical execution directly—with zero handoffs to junior staff. We help growing tech organizations build future-proof organic engines that drive clear visibility, authoritative citations, and real business revenue.",[81,850,852],{"id":851},"ready-to-modernize-your-search-strategy","Ready to Modernize Your Search Strategy?",[46,854,855,863,870],{},[49,856,857,858,862],{},"Organic search is constantly shifting. Let’s figure it out together. We help tech leaders cut through the noise and build search strategies that actually drive growth. Explore our ",[206,859,861],{"href":208,"rel":860},[210],"Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Services"," or book your initial search strategy review.",[49,864,865,866,278],{},"Skip the generic SEO agency playbook. Our senior team works alongside you to build a tailored search strategy that gets your brand seen. Ready to fix traffic drops or scale what’s already working? ",[206,867,869],{"href":275,"rel":868},[210],"Contact MKG Marketing today",[49,871,872,873,212],{},"Ready to learn more about content quality in the age of artificial intelligence? We got you covered:",[206,874,877],{"href":875,"rel":876},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fis-ai-content-bad-for-seo-how-to-scale-traffic-without-sacrificing-rankings\u002F",[210]," Is AI Content Bad for SEO? How to Scale Traffic Without Sacrificing Rankings",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":879},[880,884,887,890,895],{"id":602,"depth":291,"text":603,"children":881},[882,883],{"id":619,"depth":297,"text":620},{"id":644,"depth":297,"text":645},{"id":658,"depth":291,"text":662,"children":885},[886],{"id":685,"depth":297,"text":109},{"id":709,"depth":291,"text":713,"children":888},[889],{"id":786,"depth":297,"text":787},{"id":807,"depth":291,"text":808,"children":891},[892,893,894],{"id":814,"depth":297,"text":815},{"id":821,"depth":297,"text":822},{"id":828,"depth":297,"text":829},{"id":835,"depth":291,"text":839,"children":896},[897],{"id":851,"depth":297,"text":852},"2026-08-05T15:31:00.000Z","Traditional SEO is shifting. Learn how AI search engines are disrupting the ten blue links and how to win brand mentions in LLM responses.","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Ff8233c21-a553-4cdf-b08e-62ba6de46295-mkg-blog-ai-search-vs-traditional-search-hero-image.webp","Stop Chasing Clicks, Capture Direct-Answer AI",{},"\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-vs-traditional-search-navigating-the-shift-to-search-visibility-optimization-svo",{"title":593,"description":899},"blog\u002Fseo\u002Fai-search-vs-traditional-search-navigating-the-shift-to-search-visibility-optimization-svo","V9JrsiIyJkiYENE0VMv29Din97ayk4JQ9vcwSe6Flz0",{"id":908,"title":909,"author":7,"authors":7,"body":910,"caption":7,"category":315,"date":1139,"description":1140,"extension":318,"img":1141,"imgAlt":1142,"meta":1143,"minutes":297,"navigation":322,"path":1144,"seo":1145,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":1146,"updated":7,"__hash__":1147},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fsearch-visibility-optimization-svo-monthly-overview-july-2026.md","Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Monthly Overview - July 2026",{"type":11,"value":911,"toc":1131},[912,918,967,973,1009,1015,1050,1056,1083,1089,1092,1097,1100,1103,1123],[24,913,915],{"id":914},"executive-summary-the-tldr",[52,916,917],{},"Executive Summary (The TL;DR)",[46,919,920,932,943,955],{},[49,921,922,925,926,931],{},[52,923,924],{},"Google Refines Helpful Content Systems:"," The",[206,927,930],{"href":928,"rel":929},"https:\u002F\u002Fadelev8.com\u002Fblog\u002Fgoogle-july-2026-helpful-content-update",[210]," July 2026 Helpful Content Update"," shifts evaluation metrics from blunt site-wide penalties to granular, section-level filtering, strictly penalizing synthetic, low-effort material while rewarding verified practitioner expertise.",[49,933,934,937,938,212],{},[52,935,936],{},"AI Overviews Expansion:"," Google integrated live news carousels and direct image generation inside AI Overviews, which now feature in approximately",[206,939,942],{"href":940,"rel":941},"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.artificialintelligence-news.com\u002Fnews\u002Fgoogle-ai-overviews-us-searches\u002F",[210]," 43% of US searches",[49,944,945,948,949,954],{},[52,946,947],{},"Search Console Controls Updates:"," Site owners can now explicitly manage and isolate content inclusion within AI Overviews and AI Mode via",[206,950,953],{"href":951,"rel":952},"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.numinix.com\u002Fblog\u002Fjuly-2026-seo-algorithm-news-update\u002F",[210]," updated Search Console controls"," without sacrificing baseline organic rankings.",[49,956,957,960,961,966],{},[52,958,959],{},"AEO and Third Party Integration:"," ChatGPT’s integration of live third-party platform data (such as",[206,962,965],{"href":963,"rel":964},"https:\u002F\u002Fsearchengineland.com\u002Fgoogle-to-update-local-services-ads-policies-in-july-479653",[210]," Yelp reviews, ratings, and photos",") forces B2B and B2C brands to optimize their multi-platform digital footprints beyond owned properties.",[24,968,970],{"id":969},"algorithm-technical-seo-updates",[52,971,972],{},"Algorithm & Technical SEO Updates",[46,974,975,987,998],{},[49,976,977,980,981,986],{},[52,978,979],{},"The July 2026 Helpful Content Update:"," Google deployed a ",[206,982,985],{"href":983,"rel":984},"https:\u002F\u002Fseovendor.co\u002Fgoogle-algorithm-updates-july-2026\u002F",[210],"targeted update"," to its Helpful Content System, tightening synthetic content detection and increasing E-E-A-T weightings. Unlike previous iterations that carried a risk of broad site-wide demotions, this update introduces granular section-level assessments, permitting well-authored pages on otherwise mixed-quality domains to retain visibility.",[49,988,989,992,993,997],{},[52,990,991],{},"Global Spam Countermeasures:"," Running alongside minor core adjustments, ",[206,994,996],{"href":951,"rel":995},[210],"a global spam update"," rolled out to refine SpamBrain heuristics, targeting systemic manipulation patterns rather than isolated link-building tactics.",[49,999,1000,1003,1004,1008],{},[52,1001,1002],{},"Search Console Shifts:"," Platform-wide properties and explicit GEO isolation controls ",[206,1005,1007],{"href":951,"rel":1006},[210],"went live",", enabling technical leaders to partition content accessibility for generative experiences without damaging classic organic indexing.",[24,1010,1012],{"id":1011},"geoaeo-updates",[52,1013,1014],{},"GEO\u002FAEO Updates",[46,1016,1017,1027,1038],{},[49,1018,1019,1022,1023,1026],{},[52,1020,1021],{},"AI Overview Saturation & Features:"," Market intelligence indicates AI Overviews now appear in roughly",[206,1024,942],{"href":940,"rel":1025},[210],", fundamentally altering click-through dynamics. July updates added real-time news carousels and native AI-generated image creation directly into query responses, shifting user engagement loops.",[49,1028,1029,1032,1033,1037],{},[52,1030,1031],{},"Cross-Platform Citation Shifts:"," ChatGPT expanded its retrieval architecture by integrating live third-party review and vector data (including",[206,1034,1036],{"href":963,"rel":1035},[210]," Yelp reviews and ratings","), illustrating that LLM engines rely heavily on aggregated ecosystem trust signals rather than just corporate web properties.",[49,1039,1040,1043,1044,1049],{},[52,1041,1042],{},"The \"Ghost Citation\" Phenomenon:"," ",[206,1045,1048],{"href":1046,"rel":1047},"https:\u002F\u002Fsearchengineland.com\u002Fai-halftime-report-h1-2026-483912",[210],"Emerging tracking data"," highlights that AI engines frequently synthesize information from third-party aggregators and forums, leaving primary creators uncredited unless structured entities are explicitly claimed and verified.",[24,1051,1053],{"id":1052},"strategic-implications-for-leaders",[52,1054,1055],{},"Strategic Implications for Leaders",[46,1057,1058,1064],{},[49,1059,1060,1063],{},[52,1061,1062],{},"What to ignore:"," Short-term ranking fluctuations and mass content deletions. High-volume, automated articles no longer hold value under current search filters, making rapid content generation counterproductive.",[49,1065,1066,1069],{},[52,1067,1068],{},"Where to pivot:",[46,1070,1071,1077],{},[49,1072,1073,1076],{},[52,1074,1075],{},"Clean up low-value content:"," Review site pages for thin or AI-generated text. Replace surface-level summaries with original research, customer case studies, and expert data that language models cannot replicate.",[49,1078,1079,1082],{},[52,1080,1081],{},"Standardize off-page brand data:"," Align Schema markup, corporate records, and third-party profiles across major directories and review platforms. Search engines and AI systems rely heavily on external sources to verify company authority.",[24,1084,1086],{"id":1085},"looking-ahead",[52,1087,1088],{},"Looking Ahead",[14,1090,1091],{},"Google historically issues a major core algorithm update in late Q3. Growth teams should focus on deepening coverage within core subject areas rather than publishing broadly across adjacent topics.",[24,1093,1095],{"id":1094},"search-visibility-optimization-svo",[52,1096,168],{},[14,1098,1099],{},"Maintaining search traffic now requires managing three distinct channels: standard web indexing, answer engine citations (AEO), and generative search layouts (GEO).",[14,1101,1102],{},"MKG assists growth-stage technology companies with:",[46,1104,1105,1111,1117],{},[49,1106,1107,1110],{},[52,1108,1109],{},"GEO and AEO Audits:"," Evaluating brand presence and citation rates across ChatGPT, Perplexity, and Google AI Overviews.",[49,1112,1113,1116],{},[52,1114,1115],{},"Structured Data Infrastructure:"," Aligning Schema markup and technical index controls to safeguard search presence.",[49,1118,1119,1122],{},[52,1120,1121],{},"Pipeline Attribution Modeling:"," Measuring how generative search visibility impacts customer acquisition costs (CAC) and deal velocity.",[14,1124,1125,1126,1130],{},"To review your domain's generative search visibility, ",[206,1127,1129],{"href":275,"rel":1128},[210],"schedule a consultation"," with an MKG search specialist.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":1132},[1133,1134,1135,1136,1137,1138],{"id":914,"depth":291,"text":917},{"id":969,"depth":291,"text":972},{"id":1011,"depth":291,"text":1014},{"id":1052,"depth":291,"text":1055},{"id":1085,"depth":291,"text":1088},{"id":1094,"depth":291,"text":168},"2026-08-04T16:16:55.368Z","Stay updated on the July 2026 search landscape: Google’s granular Helpful Content Update, AI Overviews reaching 43% of US searches, new Search Console controls for AI Mode, and ChatGPT's integration of third-party platform data.","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F9bacf7c4-18eb-47f1-87fb-986cba555a73-Copy of 11766_(1920x1080) (7).png","close-up image of a blue pushpin marking a location on a detailed paper map",{},"\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fsearch-visibility-optimization-svo-monthly-overview-july-2026",{"title":909,"description":1140},"blog\u002Fseo\u002Fsearch-visibility-optimization-svo-monthly-overview-july-2026","vjZWWe3kKlLwQrZGoaeSywpxYkFiYyKtWSho-GG-CHw",{"id":1149,"title":1150,"author":7,"authors":7,"body":1151,"caption":7,"category":315,"date":1461,"description":1462,"extension":318,"img":1463,"imgAlt":1464,"meta":1465,"minutes":321,"navigation":322,"path":1466,"seo":1467,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":1468,"updated":7,"__hash__":1469},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fis-ai-content-bad-for-seo-how-to-scale-traffic-without-sacrificing-rankings.md","Is AI Content Bad for SEO? How to Scale Traffic Without Sacrificing Rankings",{"type":11,"value":1152,"toc":1445},[1153,1160,1166,1169,1184,1187,1190,1204,1211,1214,1218,1221,1227,1238,1244,1247,1253,1264,1266,1271,1274,1277,1282,1287,1294,1301,1304,1310,1313,1319,1322,1333,1339,1342,1349,1358,1365,1372,1377,1380,1395,1401,1407,1410,1417,1421],[14,1154,1155,1156,1159],{},"Let’s answer the question on every marketing leader’s mind right away: ",[52,1157,1158],{},"No, AI content is not inherently bad for SEO."," Google does not automatically penalize text simply because an artificial intelligence model generated it. In fact, Google’s official Search guidelines state that the search engine ranks content based on its helpfulness, relevance, and quality—not on who (or what) typed the words.",[14,1161,1162,1163],{},"However, there is a massive caveat that every modern CMO and VP of Marketing must understand: ",[52,1164,1165],{},"publishing unedited, mass-produced AI text is a fast track to losing traffic.",[14,1167,1168],{},"While AI can drastically accelerate your research and drafting phases, relying on raw algorithm outputs to power your organic search strategy will inevitably hurt your brand. The internet is quickly becoming flooded with synthesized, low-effort fluff. Search engines are aggressively updating their algorithms to identify and down-rank generic copy that fails to bring new value to the web.",[14,1170,1171,1172,1175,1176,1179,1180,1183],{},"So, ",[52,1173,1174],{},"does AI-generated content impact SEO?"," Absolutely—for better or for worse depending entirely on ",[38,1177,1178],{},"how"," you use it. To navigate this new era of search, B2B software and tech companies must learn how to safely leverage AI as an efficiency tool while keeping senior human strategy in full control. ",[75,1181],{"alt":77,"src":1182},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fe5fe90d6-da9d-42d8-8ca3-5c601eb33fc8-ai-content-bad-for-seo-1.png","What Google Actually Cites About AI-Generated Content",[14,1185,1186],{},"A widespread myth floating around boardrooms is that Google possesses a universal \"AI detector\" that immediately penalizes any site using machine learning tools. This misconception has led to two extreme behaviors: organizations either banned AI entirely out of fear, or they went all-in, firing editorial teams and pumping out hundreds of unvetted AI articles a month.",[14,1188,1189],{},"Both approaches are flawed. Google’s position on AI content is clear and consistent:",[46,1191,1192,1198],{},[49,1193,1194,1197],{},[52,1195,1196],{},"Intent matters over medium:"," If you use automation, including generative AI, primarily to manipulate search rankings, it is considered a violation of Google's spam policies.",[49,1199,1200,1203],{},[52,1201,1202],{},"Quality is the ultimate benchmark:"," If your content offers original information, insightful analysis, and clear utility to the searcher, Google will reward it—regardless of whether AI helped draft the paragraphs.",[14,1205,1206,1207,1210],{},"This distinction rests on Google’s ",[52,1208,1209],{},"E-E-A-T framework",": Experience, Expertise, Authoritativeness, and Trustworthiness.",[14,1212,1213],{},"Generative AI models are trained on existing web data; by design, they scrape, synthesize, and regurgitate information that has already been published. They cannot draw from personal background, run proprietary benchmark studies, or conduct interviews with industry veterans. Therefore, raw AI content inherently lacks the \"First-Hand Experience\" and deep \"Expertise\" required to satisfy modern search criteria.",[24,1215,1217],{"id":1216},"why-copy-pasting-ai-copy-destroys-your-organic-traffic","Why Copy-Pasting AI Copy Destroys Your Organic Traffic",[14,1219,1220],{},"If Google doesn't penalize AI text on principle, why are so many tech sites seeing their organic impressions plummet after launching automated content initiatives? The answer lies in the subtle traps of machine-generated prose.",[81,1222,1224],{"id":1223},"_1-the-information-gain-problem",[52,1225,1226],{},"1. The Information Gain Problem",[14,1228,1229,1230,1233,1234,1237],{},"Search engine algorithms are increasingly prioritizing ",[52,1231,1232],{},"Information Gain","—a metric that measures whether a piece of content adds ",[38,1235,1236],{},"new"," facts, perspectives, or data points to a topic compared to existing index results. When an AI tool drafts an article, it simply summarizes what the top ten results on Google are already saying. It offers zero information gain. If your page is merely an average of what is already online, Google has no incentive to rank you above established competitors.",[81,1239,1241],{"id":1240},"_2-hallucinations-and-brand-risk",[52,1242,1243],{},"2. Hallucinations and Brand Risk",[14,1245,1246],{},"Large Language Models (LLMs) are predictive engines, not factual databases. They routinely invent statistics, misquote technical documentation, and present incorrect product capabilities with total confidence. Publishing hallucinated facts erodes consumer trust and signals to search crawlers that your site lacks basic editorial integrity.",[81,1248,1250],{"id":1249},"_3-the-homogenization-of-brand-voice",[52,1251,1252],{},"3. The Homogenization of Brand Voice",[14,1254,1255,1256,1259,1260,1263],{},"B2B tech buyers are sophisticated. They can spot low-effort, synthetic writing instantly. Text bloated with hollow transitions (",[38,1257,1258],{},"\"In today's fast-paced digital landscape...\""," or ",[38,1261,1262],{},"\"It is crucial to leverage...\"",") signals to prospects that your company lacks real point-of-view authority. If your content sounds identical to every competitor using the same prompts, you lose your market positioning.",[24,1265,109],{"id":685},[14,1267,1268,1270],{},[38,1269,114],{},"The AI has no reason to pick yours over theirs. It's looking for something it can confidently reuse, and if your version doesn't add anything new, you're background noise.",[14,1272,1273],{},"So instead of writing more, I'm going page by page through what already exists and asking one question: does this page say something that no other page on the internet says?",[14,1275,1276],{},"Original data. A real client pattern you documented. A first-person account of what actually happened when you tried the thing everyone recommends. ",[14,1278,1279,1280],{},"That's what AI pulls in. The generic stuff is what AI already has forty versions of. It doesn't need yours.",[38,1281,114],{},[14,1283,120,1284,1286],{},[52,1285,9],{},", CEO of MKG Marketing",[24,1288,1290,1293],{"id":1289},"how-to-safely-use-ai-as-a-marketing-assistant-not-a-lead-strategist",[75,1291],{"alt":77,"src":1292},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fc8d0926d-82b9-42f9-85f4-3c433da82d78-ai-content-bad-for-seo-2.png","How to Safely Use AI as a Marketing Assistant (Not a Lead Strategist)",[14,1295,1296,1297,1300],{},"To succeed in search today, modern tech companies don't need to abandon AI; they need to integrate it into a ",[52,1298,1299],{},"human-led editorial workflow",". AI should act as the junior analyst that handles heavy administrative lifting, while senior strategists serve as the editorial director.",[14,1302,1303],{},"Here is how high-growth organizations use AI tools safely without putting their search performance at risk:",[81,1305,1307],{"id":1306},"_1-accelerate-research-and-formatting",[52,1308,1309],{},"1. Accelerate Research and Formatting",[14,1311,1312],{},"Use AI to synthesize lengthy transcripts, cluster search intent, organize raw data, and draft initial structural outlines. Asking an AI tool to suggest five logical structural flows for a technical guide saves hours of brainstorming without diluting your editorial voice.",[81,1314,1316],{"id":1315},"_2-inject-proprietary-data-and-human-storytelling",[52,1317,1318],{},"2. Inject Proprietary Data and Human Storytelling",[14,1320,1321],{},"Once a rough outline or foundational draft exists, a subject matter expert (SME) must step in. Inject real-world elements that an algorithm can never produce:",[46,1323,1324,1327,1330],{},[49,1325,1326],{},"Customer case studies and real implementation metrics.",[49,1328,1329],{},"Direct quotes from internal product architects or sales engineers.",[49,1331,1332],{},"Unique takeaways or counter-intuitive opinions that challenge status-quo industry advice.",[81,1334,1336],{"id":1335},"_3-rigorous-fact-checking-and-editorial-oversight",[52,1337,1338],{},"3. Rigorous Fact-Checking and Editorial Oversight",[14,1340,1341],{},"Every claim, statistic, and technical instruction generated during the drafting phase must be verified by a human editor. Ensure the tone matches your brand guidelines and eliminate boilerplate AI phrasing.",[14,1343,1344,1345,1348],{},"Want to see how your current search strategy measures up against the latest engine updates? Explore our comprehensive",[206,1346,211],{"href":208,"rel":1347},[210]," or book an initial search strategy review with our senior team today.",[24,1350,1352,1355],{"id":1351},"beyond-traditional-seo-preparing-for-search-visibility-optimization-svo",[75,1353],{"alt":77,"src":1354},"https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002F2cd275b2-b56c-4864-b728-e18e54f45370-ai-content-bad-for-seo-3.png",[52,1356,1357],{},"Beyond Traditional SEO: Preparing for Search Visibility Optimization (SVO)",[14,1359,1360,1361,1364],{},"The debate over whether AI-generated content ",[52,1362,1363],{},"is good for seo"," is part of a much larger shift in how users find information. Search is no longer confined to a list of ten blue links on a traditional search results page.",[14,1366,1367,1368,1371],{},"With the rapid adoption of AI Overviews, ChatGPT, Claude, and Perplexity, users are increasingly getting direct answers synthesized and generated right inside search interfaces. This shift means that optimizing purely for keyword clicks is no longer enough. You must optimize for ",[52,1369,1370],{},"total brand visibility"," across AI search models and traditional engines alike.",[14,1373,1374,1375,212],{},"This evolution is what we call ",[52,1376,168],{},[14,1378,1379],{},"To win in an SVO-driven ecosystem, your content must be authoritative enough that AI models choose to cite your brand as the primary source of truth. Generic, auto-generated articles will never be cited by AI search tools because those articles lack original authority. The only way to capture mindshare in both AI answers and traditional search lists is by publishing high-gain, expert-driven content that clearly demonstrates E-E-A-T.",[14,1381,1382,1383,1388,1389,1394],{},"If your organic reach is stalling due to changing algorithms, taking a holistic view of your digital presence is essential. Aligning your organic content strategy with high-intent paid acquisition via",[206,1384,1387],{"href":1385,"rel":1386},"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.google.com\u002Fsearch?q=https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fservices\u002Fdigital-advertising\u002F",[210]," Digital Advertising"," and measuring true user journeys through robust",[206,1390,1393],{"href":1391,"rel":1392},"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.google.com\u002Fsearch?q=https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fservices\u002Fanalytics\u002F",[210]," Digital Analytics"," ensures your marketing engine generates pipeline—not just empty clicks.",[24,1396,1398],{"id":1397},"summary-adapting-your-search-engine-strategy-for-long-term-growth",[52,1399,1400],{},"Summary: Adapting Your Search Engine Strategy for Long-Term Growth",[14,1402,1403,1404,1406],{},"To recap: ",[52,1405,1174],{}," Yes. If you treat AI as a magic shortcut to generate hundreds of unvetted blog posts, your search visibility will eventually collapse; quickly building a house out of AI sticks won’t protect you when the Big Bad Search Engine Wolf comes calling. But if you treat AI as an efficiency engine that supports a human-led, expert-driven content pipeline, you can scale output without sacrificing rankings.",[14,1408,1409],{},"As search engines adapt to the flood of synthetic content, companies must adapt how they communicate with their buyers. The brands that win over the next decade won't be those that avoid AI, nor will they be those that hand their entire marketing strategy over to algorithms. The winners will be the organizations that pair cutting-edge tools with an authentic, human-driven brand voice.",[14,1411,1412,1413,1416],{},"At ",[52,1414,1415],{},"MKG Marketing",", we don't pass your search strategy off to junior account managers or unmonitored software bots. We provide an experienced, senior-led team that handles both the high-level strategy and technical execution directly. We help B2B tech and software companies navigate complex search updates, build a sustainable organic pipeline, and maintain complete operational control over their brand narrative.",[24,1418,1420],{"id":1419},"ready-to-build-a-future-proof-search-strategy","Ready to Build a Future-Proof Search Strategy?",[46,1422,1423,1430,1437],{},[49,1424,1425,1426,212],{},"Learn how our senior-led team can audit and elevate your organic reach.",[206,1427,1429],{"href":208,"rel":1428},[210]," Explore our Search Visibility Optimization (SVO) Services & Strategy Reviews",[49,1431,1432,1433,278],{},"Have immediate questions about your traffic or upcoming search updates?",[206,1434,1436],{"href":275,"rel":1435},[210]," Contact the MKG Marketing Team directly",[49,1438,1439,1440,212],{},"Want to dive deeper into modern search trends? Read our latest guide:",[206,1441,1444],{"href":1442,"rel":1443},"https:\u002F\u002Fmkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fblog\u002F",[210]," Beyond Last-Click: How to Measure Marketing Influence in an AI-First World",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":1446},[1447,1452,1453,1458,1459,1460],{"id":1216,"depth":291,"text":1217,"children":1448},[1449,1450,1451],{"id":1223,"depth":297,"text":1226},{"id":1240,"depth":297,"text":1243},{"id":1249,"depth":297,"text":1252},{"id":685,"depth":291,"text":109},{"id":1289,"depth":291,"text":1293,"children":1454},[1455,1456,1457],{"id":1306,"depth":297,"text":1309},{"id":1315,"depth":297,"text":1318},{"id":1335,"depth":297,"text":1338},{"id":1351,"depth":291,"text":1357},{"id":1397,"depth":291,"text":1400},{"id":1419,"depth":291,"text":1420},"2026-07-31T16:42:23.391Z","Does AI-generated content impact SEO? Discover how to safely use AI tools to build traffic and why copy-pasting generic text will hurt your rankings.","https:\u002F\u002Fassets.mkgmarketinginc.com\u002Fa2137492-5860-4960-8c3b-cc662b7514b0-mkg-blog-is-ai-content-bad-for-seo.webp","Is AI Content Bad for SEO",{},"\u002Fblog\u002Fseo\u002Fis-ai-content-bad-for-seo-how-to-scale-traffic-without-sacrificing-rankings",{"title":1150,"description":1462},"blog\u002Fseo\u002Fis-ai-content-bad-for-seo-how-to-scale-traffic-without-sacrificing-rankings","ysFwsXe-UHutD2vqfe9YpM1Dn_CZgi--Ors35vnm0Bc",{"id":1471,"title":1472,"author":7,"authors":1473,"body":1475,"caption":7,"category":4080,"date":4081,"description":4082,"extension":318,"img":7,"imgAlt":77,"meta":4083,"minutes":4085,"navigation":322,"path":4086,"seo":4087,"seodescription":7,"seotitle":7,"stem":4088,"updated":7,"__hash__":4089,"people":4090},"blog\u002Fblog\u002Findustry\u002Fbuilding-trust-and-respect-crucial-convos-for-a-profitable-partnership.md","Building Trust & Respect Through Partnership",[9,1474],"Mike Krass",{"type":11,"value":1476,"toc":4073},[1477,1483,1486,1492,1506,1515,1527,1533,1536,1539,1542,1545,1548,1551,1554,1557,1560,1563,1566,1569,1572,1575,1578,1581,1584,1587,1590,1593,1596,1599,1602,1605,1608,1611,1614,1617,1620,1623,1626,1629,1632,1635,1638,1641,1644,1647,1650,1653,1656,1659,1662,1665,1668,1671,1674,1677,1680,1683,1686,1689,1692,1695,1698,1701,1704,1707,1710,1713,1716,1719,1722,1725,1728,1731,1734,1737,1740,1743,1746,1749,1752,1755,1758,1761,1764,1767,1770,1773,1776,1779,1782,1785,1788,1791,1794,1797,1800,1803,1806,1809,1812,1815,1818,1821,1824,1827,1830,1833,1836,1839,1842,1845,1848,1851,1854,1857,1860,1863,1866,1869,1872,1875,1878,1881,1884,1887,1890,1893,1896,1899,1902,1905,1908,1911,1914,1917,1920,1923,1926,1929,1932,1935,1938,1941,1944,1947,1950,1953,1956,1959,1962,1965,1968,1971,1974,1977,1980,1983,1986,1989,1992,1995,1998,2001,2004,2007,2010,2013,2016,2019,2022,2025,2028,2031,2034,2037,2040,2043,2046,2049,2052,2055,2058,2061,2064,2066,2068,2071,2074,2077,2080,2083,2086,2089,2092,2095,2098,2101,2104,2107,2110,2113,2116,2119,2122,2125,2128,2131,2134,2137,2140,2143,2146,2149,2152,2155,2158,2161,2164,2167,2170,2173,2176,2179,2182,2185,2188,2191,2194,2197,2200,2203,2206,2209,2212,2215,2218,2221,2224,2227,2230,2233,2236,2239,2242,2245,2248,2251,2254,2257,2260,2263,2266,2269,2272,2275,2278,2281,2284,2287,2290,2293,2296,2299,2302,2305,2308,2311,2314,2317,2320,2323,2326,2329,2332,2335,2338,2341,2344,2347,2350,2353,2356,2359,2362,2365,2367,2370,2373,2376,2379,2382,2385,2388,2391,2394,2397,2400,2403,2406,2409,2412,2415,2418,2421,2424,2427,2430,2433,2436,2439,2442,2445,2448,2451,2454,2457,2460,2463,2466,2469,2472,2475,2478,2481,2484,2487,2490,2493,2496,2499,2502,2505,2508,2511,2514,2517,2520,2523,2526,2529,2532,2535,2538,2541,2544,2547,2550,2553,2556,2559,2562,2565,2568,2571,2574,2577,2580,2583,2586,2589,2592,2595,2598,2601,2604,2607,2610,2613,2616,2619,2622,2625,2628,2631,2634,2637,2640,2643,2646,2649,2652,2655,2658,2661,2664,2667,2670,2673,2676,2679,2682,2685,2688,2691,2694,2697,2700,2703,2706,2709,2712,2715,2718,2721,2724,2727,2730,2733,2736,2739,2742,2745,2748,2751,2754,2757,2760,2763,2766,2769,2772,2775,2778,2781,2784,2787,2790,2793,2796,2799,2802,2805,2808,2811,2814,2817,2820,2823,2826,2829,2832,2835,2838,2841,2844,2847,2850,2853,2856,2859,2862,2865,2868,2871,2874,2877,2880,2883,2886,2889,2892,2895,2898,2901,2904,2907,2910,2913,2916,2919,2922,2925,2928,2931,2934,2937,2940,2943,2946,2949,2952,2955,2958,2961,2964,2967,2970,2973,2976,2979,2982,2985,2988,2991,2994,2997,3000,3003,3006,3008,3011,3014,3017,3020,3023,3026,3029,3032,3035,3038,3041,3044,3047,3050,3053,3056,3059,3062,3065,3068,3071,3074,3077,3080,3083,3086,3089,3092,3095,3098,3101,3104,3107,3110,3113,3116,3118,3120,3123,3126,3129,3132,3135,3138,3141,3144,3147,3150,3153,3156,3159,3162,3165,3168,3171,3174,3177,3180,3183,3186,3189,3192,3195,3198,3201,3204,3207,3210,3213,3216,3219,3222,3225,3228,3231,3234,3237,3240,3243,3246,3249,3252,3255,3258,3261,3264,3267,3270,3273,3276,3279,3282,3285,3288,3291,3294,3297,3300,3303,3306,3309,3312,3315,3318,3321,3324,3327,3330,3333,3336,3339,3342,3345,3348,3351,3354,3357,3360,3363,3366,3369,3372,3375,3378,3381,3384,3387,3390,3393,3396,3399,3402,3405,3408,3410,3413,3416,3419,3422,3425,3428,3431,3434,3437,3440,3443,3446,3449,3452,3455,3458,3461,3464,3467,3470,3473,3476,3479,3482,3485,3488,3491,3494,3497,3500,3503,3505,3508,3511,3514,3517,3520,3523,3526,3528,3531,3534,3537,3540,3543,3546,3549,3552,3555,3558,3561,3564,3567,3570,3573,3576,3579,3582,3585,3588,3591,3594,3597,3600,3602,3605,3608,3611,3614,3617,3620,3623,3626,3629,3632,3635,3638,3641,3644,3647,3650,3653,3656,3659,3662,3665,3668,3671,3674,3677,3680,3683,3686,3689,3692,3695,3698,3701,3704,3707,3710,3713,3716,3719,3722,3725,3728,3731,3734,3737,3740,3743,3746,3749,3752,3755,3758,3761,3764,3767,3770,3773,3776,3779,3782,3785,3788,3791,3794,3797,3800,3803,3806,3809,3812,3815,3818,3821,3824,3827,3830,3833,3836,3839,3842,3845,3848,3851,3854,3857,3860,3863,3866,3868,3871,3874,3877,3879,3882,3885,3888,3891,3894,3897,3900,3903,3906,3909,3912,3915,3918,3921,3924,3927,3930,3933,3936,3939,3942,3945,3948,3951,3954,3957,3960,3963,3966,3969,3972,3975,3978,3981,3984,3987,3990,3993,3996,3999,4002,4005,4008,4011,4014,4017,4020,4023,4026,4029,4032,4035,4038,4041,4044,4047,4050,4053,4056,4059,4062,4065,4068,4071],[24,1478,1480],{"id":1479},"overview",[52,1481,1482],{},"Overview:",[14,1484,1485],{},"Kerry Guard and Mike Krass, founders of MKG Marketing, joined Staci Gray on her podcast to discuss their journey. They explored the significance of visionary and integrator roles, their personal paths to entrepreneurship influenced by family and early career experiences, and the evolution of their partnership over time. The discussion also covered strategies for scaling the business, work-life balance, and fostering a supportive workplace. They highlighted the importance of structured communication and mutual respect in maintaining a healthy business relationship. Kerry and Mike concluded by sharing their vision for MKG's future, focusing on specialized marketing services for the software and cybersecurity sectors.",[24,1487,1489],{"id":1488},"key-moments",[52,1490,1491],{},"Key Moments:",[46,1493,1494,1497,1500,1503],{},[49,1495,1496],{},"Roles and Dynamics: Mike and Kerry discussed their evolving roles within MKG Marketing, focusing on the distinction between visionary and integrator roles and how they manage the continuous flow of new ideas and strategies for the company.",[49,1498,1499],{},"Entrepreneurial Backgrounds: Both speakers shared their paths to entrepreneurship, influenced by their early careers and personal connections, highlighting how their experiences shaped their approach to business and partnership.",[49,1501,1502],{},"Partnership and Company Growth: They detailed the formation of MKG Marketing, emphasizing the importance of mutual respect, clear communication, and aligned values in overcoming challenges and successfully scaling the business.",[49,1504,1505],{},"Future Directions: Mike outlined his vision for transforming MKG into a more specialized agency with a focus on specific sectors like software and cybersecurity, aiming for a diversified service model that adds value to their niche market.",[24,1507,1509,1512],{"id":1508},"take-a-listen",[1510,1511],"br",{},[52,1513,1514],{},"Take a listen:",[24,1516,1517],{"id":77},[1518,1519],"iframe",{"width":1520,"height":1521,"src":1522,"title":1523,"frameBorder":1524,"allow":1525,"referrerPolicy":1526,"allowFullScreen":322},560,315,"https:\u002F\u002Fwww.youtube.com\u002Fembed\u002F4bS6uNuqeh0?si=HDigp3ozFv2bm2Ge","YouTube video player","0","accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share","strict-origin-when-cross-origin",[24,1528,1530],{"id":1529},"transcript",[52,1531,1532],{},"Transcript:",[14,1534,1535],{},"Mike Krass [00:00:00]:",[14,1537,1538],{},"But it's created a different space for me to act in a visionary role, which doesn't necessarily have a beginning. In the end, it's kind of like a big ball of yarn that just continues forever. Like, I'm gonna set 2 hours on Tuesday morning, and then the vision will be done. Like, the vision changes every single time I speak to somebody. It changes just a little bit.",[14,1540,1541],{},"Kerry Guard [00:00:17]:",[14,1543,1544],{},"I don't need to integrate every single idea he has all the time. Sometimes he just has ideas and he needs to say them, and I need to give him space to say them. Love my subconscious, hang out with them. And then there's gonna be one or two that I say, okay, I see it. I got to see. I call them lily pads, right? So, like, I don't want to not say no to an idea. I just can't quite see the lily pads yet. So the minute I can see the lily pads, it's a minute.",[14,1546,1547],{},"Kerry Guard [00:00:37]:",[14,1549,1550],{},"I'm like, okay, let's dig into this and figure out what this means and how this might impact the company in a bigger way.",[14,1552,1553],{},"Staci Gray [00:00:50]:",[14,1555,1556],{},"Okay.",[14,1558,1559],{},"Staci Gray [00:00:51]:",[14,1561,1562],{},"So today we have Mike and Carrie. I have met them through the entrepreneurs organization. And something I love about EO is that it really helps you scale, trust, and in the visionary and integrator dynamic, that's critical. So I'm eager to have a conversation with these two about how they forge their visionary integrator relationship and what that journey looked like. And at the tail end of this, we'll talk about what they do and how you can connect with them. But I'd love to kick it off and start with you both clearly have business. So at what point in your either childhood work situation did you realize that you were meant to be an entrepreneur or to create something out of nothing? What did that journey look like for you, individually and collectively?",[14,1564,1565],{},"Kerry Guard [00:01:41]:",[14,1567,1568],{},"I went to school for photography, and as a photographer, you generally need to strike out on your own, start your own business. And when I was working, I was interning the summer of freshman year for.",[14,1570,1571],{},"Kerry Guard [00:01:54]:",[14,1573,1574],{},"A fashion photographer in Philadelphia.",[14,1576,1577],{},"Kerry Guard [00:01:57]:",[14,1579,1580],{},"And so I paid close attention to the fact that he was running a business. And I didn't really realize it at the time. It didn't really, like, dawn on me that it's like an entrepreneurial thing.",[14,1582,1583],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:07]:",[14,1585,1586],{},"I just felt like, photographer, run a business. That's what you do.",[14,1588,1589],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:11]:",[14,1591,1592],{},"But then I really wanted to live in New York. It was the dream. And so to do that, I had to get a grown up job. And so my uncle got me into media planning for Universal McCann in New York City.",[14,1594,1595],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:24]:",[14,1597,1598],{},"And so that's when I joined the.",[14,1600,1601],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:25]:",[14,1603,1604],{},"Bigger organization and realized, I don't have.",[14,1606,1607],{},"Staci Gray [00:02:28]:",[14,1609,1610],{},"To run a business. This is glorious.",[14,1612,1613],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:30]:",[14,1615,1616],{},"It wasn't until having been in, you know, done the media planning for a.",[14,1618,1619],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:36]:",[14,1621,1622],{},"Couple years, I went from New York to Seattle.",[14,1624,1625],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:38]:",[14,1627,1628],{},"It's where I met Mike. And once I got married, my husband.",[14,1630,1631],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:43]:",[14,1633,1634],{},"Was an engineer, and he was doing really well.",[14,1636,1637],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:46]:",[14,1639,1640],{},"And there was this opportunity for me.",[14,1642,1643],{},"Kerry Guard [00:02:49]:",[14,1645,1646],{},"To strike out on my own with Mike and start this company. And I don't know that I would have made the leap had it not been for. For my husband, who had started companies in the past himself. So he had a good entrepreneurial mind about himself. And then he also was sort of.",[14,1648,1649],{},"Kerry Guard [00:03:06]:",[14,1651,1652],{},"That fallback of like, if anything goes.",[14,1654,1655],{},"Kerry Guard [00:03:08]:",[14,1657,1658],{},"Wrong, I'm going to be okay. It was just some comfort in that. I didn't have that. When I was starting thinking about starting a photography business, I was like, I have student loans to pay. I would have an apartment, I would have all these bills.",[14,1660,1661],{},"Staci Gray [00:03:19]:",[14,1663,1664],{},"This is.",[14,1666,1667],{},"Kerry Guard [00:03:20]:",[14,1669,1670],{},"I need a job. I need to be a grownup.",[14,1672,1673],{},"Staci Gray [00:03:23]:",[14,1675,1676],{},"I think this is so important because not all entrepreneurs are created equally like we think. They say that, saying that entrepreneurs are the people who will jump out of a plane and build their parachute on the way down. But not all of us are wired like that. Some of us do need to have a fallback plan to have the calmness within ourselves to be able to excel when we do start it. So your self awareness along that journey seems to have evolved as well, in.",[14,1678,1679],{},"Kerry Guard [00:03:51]:",[14,1681,1682],{},"Addition to the business side of it. How about for you, Mike?",[14,1684,1685],{},"Mike Krass [00:03:57]:",[14,1687,1688],{},"Yeah, I, growing up, had, you know, the lemonade stand on the corner and, you know, I'd wash cars and get yelled at by guys because I wasn't using the shammy, right.",[14,1690,1691],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:09]:",[14,1693,1694],{},"I'm not sure that I would call that being entrepreneurial.",[14,1696,1697],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:13]:",[14,1699,1700],{},"I think I was just more like.",[14,1702,1703],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:15]:",[14,1705,1706],{},"Making a little bit of money to.",[14,1708,1709],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:16]:",[14,1711,1712],{},"Go to the movies. But growing up, you know, what comes.",[14,1714,1715],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:19]:",[14,1717,1718],{},"To mind is I didn't quite realize.",[14,1720,1721],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:23]:",[14,1723,1724],{},"It, but I was surrounded by many entrepreneurs. So, for example, my best friend who lived around the corner, his dad started and sold two marketing agencies, one to Sir Martin Sorrell, who's like a famous guy in the ad world over globally. But, you know, he does most of his work over in England. It was just like, that was just Mister Hammerquist. That was just a guy who went to work. And they always had Mac, like the.",[14,1726,1727],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:47]:",[14,1729,1730],{},"Big Mac, you know, the ones with.",[14,1732,1733],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:49]:",[14,1735,1736],{},"The colors on the back before anybody else did. So I didn't know what they did.",[14,1738,1739],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:53]:",[14,1741,1742],{},"But I was like, they have, like, the cool computer and our family still.",[14,1744,1745],{},"Mike Krass [00:04:57]:",[14,1747,1748],{},"Putting, like, the tablecloth over the computer at the end of the day, you know, like, you don't look at that ugly monitor. So I had those examples in my life, and I didn't even realize what was happening.",[14,1750,1751],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:06]:",[14,1753,1754],{},"Like, my uncle, you know, in Minneapolis, ran a law firm, right?",[14,1756,1757],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:10]:",[14,1759,1760],{},"No idea. My other uncle, also in Minneapolis, is a trial attorney. Ran his own trial attorney practice. To me, it was just like, this is just what they do. And I share these stories because when it came time for us to start.",[14,1762,1763],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:24]:",[14,1765,1766],{},"MKG marketing, I don't know that I.",[14,1768,1769],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:28]:",[14,1771,1772],{},"Would have launched into it if I hadn't had some of those examples around me. Even though I didn't have quite the awareness of what was happening there, I was still like, that's Uncle Paul. That's Uncle Rod. Like, that's Mister Hammerquist in my life that I. I see them doing these type of entrepreneurial things, even though I.",[14,1774,1775],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:46]:",[14,1777,1778],{},"Can'T quite name it because I just didn't even.",[14,1780,1781],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:48]:",[14,1783,1784],{},"I didn't have the language at that point.",[14,1786,1787],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:49]:",[14,1789,1790],{},"It was just like, that's just what they do.",[14,1792,1793],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:51]:",[14,1795,1796],{},"Like, Uncle Rod goes to court. Like, that's where work is. Like, he goes to trial. Like, I have no concept what happens around that, but I know that that's.",[14,1798,1799],{},"Mike Krass [00:05:58]:",[14,1801,1802],{},"Where work happened for Uncle Rod.",[14,1804,1805],{},"Kerry Guard [00:06:00]:",[14,1807,1808],{},"Yeah.",[14,1810,1811],{},"Staci Gray [00:06:01]:",[14,1813,1814],{},"And when you saw them doing that, was it something that you admired or was it just a known.",[14,1816,1817],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:11]:",[14,1819,1820],{},"I don't think I admired much. Except for, again, they had the cool Macs at my friend's house around the corner. And we didn't have those cool ones at my house. I think I didn't even realize it. It was just like, these are people around me.",[14,1822,1823],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:26]:",[14,1825,1826],{},"I didn't have some awareness of that.",[14,1828,1829],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:28]:",[14,1831,1832],{},"Until probably Carrie and I really started getting serious about starting MKG marketing. And then about eight years ago, I was volunteering as an entrepreneur in residence at a group called the idea Village here in New Orleans. And somebody came in and they actually said they were pitching to be an accelerator company.",[14,1834,1835],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:44]:",[14,1837,1838],{},"And they said, people that come from my background and that look like me.",[14,1840,1841],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:50]:",[14,1843,1844],{},"I don't know any of us who start companies. And I had this moment hearing that.",[14,1846,1847],{},"Mike Krass [00:06:55]:",[14,1849,1850],{},"Where I was just like, huh? Like, I've known people that look like.",[14,1852,1853],{},"Mike Krass [00:07:00]:",[14,1855,1856],{},"Me and don't look like me that have started companies, but I'm surrounded. Like, that's part of my life. And this woman who is incredibly, the idea was terrible, but she was great. We almost actually brought her in the accelerator because we're like, she's awesome and she can make anything work. But the idea was very bad. It needed a lot of love, and she just wasn't ready for an accelerator yet. But having that experience, it was just kind of known. Using your language states like, it was just like, this is kind of around me, even though I can't quite put my finger on it until later in life when I could actually, like, label it and understand what it was.",[14,1858,1859],{},"Staci Gray [00:07:32]:",[14,1861,1862],{},"Yeah, I have a similar story because my grandfather built a company to take public and my other grandfather had a successful insurance company and my father had a successful business. And so I watched entrepreneurship around me and my journey was organic. I didn't really think I wanted to do it. I fell into it. And so I feel like so many entrepreneurs, they pursue it differently, and then it's like, I've got something here. This idea is taking shape and then scaling. It's like, okay, now all the customers are coming. I've got all of the operational chaos.",[14,1864,1865],{},"Staci Gray [00:08:04]:",[14,1867,1868],{},"I've got structure and systems and hiring and how do I do this all and not lose my sanity? In my experience, it's finding that visionary integrator relationship that is just magical. And so I want to see, how did you guys meet? How did you know? You trusted yourself enough, each other enough and yourself enough, really to forge a partnership? Because partnerships can go south, too.",[14,1870,1871],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:30]:",[14,1873,1874],{},"So how did that evolve?",[14,1876,1877],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:34]:",[14,1879,1880],{},"This is a retrospective right here. I don't know that we've ever, I.",[14,1882,1883],{},"Staci Gray [00:08:37]:",[14,1885,1886],{},"Mean, I don't know that I've ever.",[14,1888,1889],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:38]:",[14,1891,1892],{},"Thought about it this way. So we met at our previous agency many moons ago.",[14,1894,1895],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:44]:",[14,1897,1898],{},"20, 2010, 2011.",[14,1900,1901],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:48]:",[14,1903,1904],{},"The name, I'm not making this up.",[14,1906,1907],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:50]:",[14,1909,1910],{},"Was called Wong duty. I blush even just saying it out loud.",[14,1912,1913],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:55]:",[14,1915,1916],{},"Probably at their attention.",[14,1918,1919],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:57]:",[14,1921,1922],{},"It's very memorable.",[14,1924,1925],{},"Staci Gray [00:08:58]:",[14,1927,1928],{},"Good on them.",[14,1930,1931],{},"Kerry Guard [00:08:59]:",[14,1933,1934],{},"But they were a creative agency who.",[14,1936,1937],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:02]:",[14,1939,1940],{},"Happened to have media planners in house for me and Mike.",[14,1942,1943],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:07]:",[14,1945,1946],{},"So because it was just the two.",[14,1948,1949],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:08]:",[14,1951,1952],{},"Of us, I think we just formed a bond very quickly on how to approach each client. I mean, everything, every campaign was a dual effort.",[14,1954,1955],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:21]:",[14,1957,1958],{},"We were working on everything side by side.",[14,1960,1961],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:24]:",[14,1963,1964],{},"I remember even when we interviewed, we.",[14,1966,1967],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:28]:",[14,1969,1970],{},"Just got along, was like, yeah, this is going to be a really good working relationship. I can see this. This is going to be awesome. He was one of the reasons why I actually left. I was at MEC working on the Microsoft account and they had a recruiter headhunt me to come to long duty, and I was really on the fence.",[14,1972,1973],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:42]:",[14,1975,1976],{},"About it because I was, was living the life.",[14,1978,1979],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:45]:",[14,1981,1982],{},"It's been a pretty cushy job.",[14,1984,1985],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:47]:",[14,1987,1988],{},"Didn't want to rock the boat, but.",[14,1990,1991],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:49]:",[14,1993,1994],{},"Between Mike and then somebody else at the company, a good friend of ours now, Steve Kesselman. I was like, these are really great smart people who are going to push.",[14,1996,1997],{},"Kerry Guard [00:09:58]:",[14,1999,2000],{},"Me and elevate me, and I'm ready for that. So, yeah, so I think right out.",[14,2002,2003],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:04]:",[14,2005,2006],{},"Of the gate, when I met Mike, I was like, this is going to be good.",[14,2008,2009],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:07]:",[14,2011,2012],{},"And then we just formed a partnership.",[14,2014,2015],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:09]:",[14,2017,2018],{},"Both in, like, building ideas together and also being like, this is so frustrating. And it was out of that frustration, I believed that, you know, mKG really.",[14,2020,2021],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:18]:",[14,2023,2024],{},"Was born and we'd, you know, go.",[14,2026,2027],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:21]:",[14,2029,2030],{},"On these really lovely walks together to go get lunch. And we would just like, sort of scheme. So I think it was just through the ideation of it that we were like, yeah, this feels good. We could go do this thing. I'm curious to hear Mike's side of the story. For me, it was definitely more of a gut feeling.",[14,2032,2033],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:38]:",[14,2035,2036],{},"Like, no, I can see this.",[14,2038,2039],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:41]:",[14,2041,2042],{},"I can feel this being, like, a.",[14,2044,2045],{},"Kerry Guard [00:10:42]:",[14,2047,2048],{},"Good partnership and, yeah, let's do this thing.",[14,2050,2051],{},"Staci Gray [00:10:47]:",[14,2053,2054],{},"I am curious about Mike's perspective. And then I've got questions.",[14,2056,2057],{},"Mike Krass [00:10:53]:",[14,2059,2060],{},"I know, I know. I feel like you're separating us and deposing us in different rooms. Don't let the two parties hear one another speak.",[14,2062,2063],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:00]:",[14,2065,1808],{},[14,2067,2063],{},[14,2069,2070],{},"So how did we get together? Like Kerry mentioned, she was headhunted to come over to Wong duty, which is two people's names, by the way, to get that context. Tracy Wong and Pat duty, both are men.",[14,2072,2073],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:11]:",[14,2075,2076],{},"I bring that up because we had.",[14,2078,2079],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:13]:",[14,2081,2082],{},"A lot of people interview there and they're like, what's Tracy like? Is she nice? I'm like, well, she's kind of a guy, so you probably should figure that out before you interview with her or with him. Yeah, you know, I. I remember Carrie coming in, and I think Carrie will remember this, too. We'll see.",[14,2084,2085],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:28]:",[14,2087,2088],{},"I was just, like, cooked.",[14,2090,2091],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:30]:",[14,2093,2094],{},"Like, I, you know, we didn't have anybody in charge of that department. Seattle, where we were working, is a very kind of laid back place. But I was in, like, I was wearing a lot of sweatpants to work. And, like, nobody was saying anything because they're like, if he just keeps coming.",[14,2096,2097],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:42]:",[14,2099,2100],{},"To work, just don't worry about, like, his appearance. But, you know, you can start to.",[14,2102,2103],{},"Mike Krass [00:11:48]:",[14,2105,2106],{},"Tell outwardly, like, how is somebody, what is their body language? Like, how do they dress? You know, how are they showing up to certain things? And I was showing up as, as my friend Chris likes to say, as the horse you remember from Animal Farm, right?",[14,2108,2109],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:00]:",[14,2111,2112],{},"Like, you know, this, this thing happens. Don't worry.",[14,2114,2115],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:03]:",[14,2117,2118],{},"You know, boxer the horse will work harder, right? This thing happened, no big deal. Boxer the horse will work harder until boxer gets sold to the glue factory and boxer becomes no more. And so I was on a path of boxer the horse of just like, whatever. Like, I'll just. I'll just keep working hard. Hard. You know, I can do more. Like, I can do more.",[14,2120,2121],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:23]:",[14,2123,2124],{},"And Carrie came in and really helped.",[14,2126,2127],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:25]:",[14,2129,2130],{},"To, not just for the department, but for me.",[14,2132,2133],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:28]:",[14,2135,2136],{},"Like, kind of take a step back and understand, like, you're on an interesting.",[14,2138,2139],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:31]:",[14,2141,2142],{},"Path here and I won't stop you.",[14,2144,2145],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:33]:",[14,2147,2148],{},"If you really want to go down.",[14,2150,2151],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:34]:",[14,2153,2154],{},"It, but this is kind of like.",[14,2156,2157],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:36]:",[14,2159,2160],{},"Just objectively, like a fresh set of eyes. Like, this is kind of where you're headed to. So just bringing some awareness to that fact. And, you know, I wish that we.",[14,2162,2163],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:47]:",[14,2165,2166],{},"Had, like, this, you know, like a.",[14,2168,2169],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:49]:",[14,2171,2172],{},"Hewlett Packard style story of, like, we were in the garage tinkering, but like.",[14,2174,2175],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:53]:",[14,2177,2178],{},"Kerry said, you know, we, we really.",[14,2180,2181],{},"Mike Krass [00:12:55]:",[14,2183,2184],{},"Just kept talking as we were working through different client accounts. We were like, this is how I wish we really were doing this. But we weren't in a position to change that at that agency. It wasn't a bad thing. It just, it was our reality in that environment. And so for us, you know, we got to that point of like, well.",[14,2186,2187],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:11]:",[14,2189,2190],{},"What if we did do our own thing? And I remember I put up, it.",[14,2192,2193],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:16]:",[14,2195,2196],{},"Was like on a Friday evening or Saturday morning, like, I put up a.",[14,2198,2199],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:19]:",[14,2201,2202],{},"Little two page WordPress website which our boss immediately found.",[14,2204,2205],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:23]:",[14,2207,2208],{},"I'm not sure how he immediately found. And was like, hey, man, like, we need to talk about this.",[14,2210,2211],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:28]:",[14,2213,2214],{},"Probably because it surprised the heck out.",[14,2216,2217],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:29]:",[14,2219,2220],{},"Of him because he thought that we both worked for long duty at the moment. And he was like, what's going on here?",[14,2222,2223],{},"Staci Gray [00:13:34]:",[14,2225,2226],{},"Well, and it's not ready to take off. So he's like, wait a minute, get my horse back.",[14,2228,2229],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:39]:",[14,2231,2232],{},"Yeah, yeah. He's like, box has got to come back. And that's really, like, where we started. And as I finish my recollection of.",[14,2234,2235],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:47]:",[14,2237,2238],{},"The story, we time boxed it.",[14,2240,2241],{},"Mike Krass [00:13:49]:",[14,2243,2244],{},"We just said, let's try this. For six months. I worked nights and weekends. Kerry went full time immediately into MKG marketing. And we just said, let's try it for six months. If we can't get a client engagement.",[14,2246,2247],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:01]:",[14,2249,2250],{},"At that point, no harm, no foul.",[14,2252,2253],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:03]:",[14,2255,2256],{},"No blood, no foul.",[14,2258,2259],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:06]:",[14,2261,2262],{},"It was a great try.",[14,2264,2265],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:07]:",[14,2267,2268],{},"That's how we framed it.",[14,2270,2271],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:10]:",[14,2273,2274],{},"We're going to time boxes.",[14,2276,2277],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:11]:",[14,2279,2280],{},"We're going to have some structure. We're going to have a clear measure.",[14,2282,2283],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:14]:",[14,2285,2286],{},"Of success, which means one paying client.",[14,2288,2289],{},"Mike Krass [00:14:17]:",[14,2291,2292],{},"There wasn't notice, there wasn't an amount of money being paid. It was just somebody has to pay us. That shows that we have established a little bit of a corner in the world and somebody will pay us to continue working.",[14,2294,2295],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:31]:",[14,2297,2298],{},"I think the other thing we did.",[14,2300,2301],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:33]:",[14,2303,2304],{},"Which is interesting in the early days.",[14,2306,2307],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:35]:",[14,2309,2310],{},"Is the very first thing we did.",[14,2312,2313],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:37]:",[14,2315,2316],{},"Actually was, I remember it was in my Bellevue apartment. Mike came over and we sat down and did a, what was it called? It was like where you, it was.",[14,2318,2319],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:45]:",[14,2321,2322],{},"Like a formation agreement.",[14,2324,2325],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:47]:",[14,2327,2328],{},"And we like really sat down and said like, okay, if we're going to.",[14,2330,2331],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:49]:",[14,2333,2334],{},"Do this thing, like, what does this.",[14,2336,2337],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:50]:",[14,2339,2340],{},"Mean to us and what do we want out of it and like, what's important? And we laid it all out there. I think that was so key. Like, I was like, I want a family.",[14,2342,2343],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:57]:",[14,2345,2346],{},"I want to have kids someday.",[14,2348,2349],{},"Kerry Guard [00:14:59]:",[14,2351,2352],{},"I want to make sure I have time for them. That's really important to me. And Mike laid out what was important to him and we respect each other for that. I think that was a really key.",[14,2354,2355],{},"Kerry Guard [00:15:07]:",[14,2357,2358],{},"Piece to us feeling like we're all.",[14,2360,2361],{},"Kerry Guard [00:15:11]:",[14,2363,2364],{},"In at that point.",[14,2366,2361],{},[14,2368,2369],{},"Like, yeah, we're good here.",[14,2371,2372],{},"Staci Gray [00:15:15]:",[14,2374,2375],{},"I want to go in so many different directions right now. So I'm going to just box a couple. Since the audience is going to be people who are a little bit deeper in their journey in scaling their organizations, I'm going to box the part about testing before you launch full steam into entrepreneurship. And I feel like you guys captured that so well because that's what I did. That's what a lot of entrepreneurs do. If you don't have a paying customer, you don't have a business. So get your one paying customer and get that going. I think where scaling becomes really challenging.",[14,2377,2378],{},"Kerry Guard [00:15:45]:",[14,2380,2381],{},"Is, Carrie, what you just did is.",[14,2383,2384],{},"Staci Gray [00:15:49]:",[14,2386,2387],{},"What is the vision upfront like and what are we willing to trade or sacrifice to get it? And what are we not willing to trade or sacrifice to get it? And then also the mutual respect, I am hearing so much mutual respect between you two of knowing your individual strengths and also knowing the individual maybe struggles or challenges, but the compassion for each other that, hey, it's okay if your nose to the grinds down, head down, and you don't see the forest for the trees. I got you there and vice versa.",[14,2389,2390],{},"Kerry Guard [00:16:21]:",[14,2392,2393],{},"So how do you guys, you're kind.",[14,2395,2396],{},"Staci Gray [00:16:25]:",[14,2398,2399],{},"Of operating like co visionary, co integrator. How do you delineate your lanes and own them so you don't step on each other's toes or get into kind of below the line conversations? Blame game. All that stuff that can, can happen in visionary integrated relationships.",[14,2401,2402],{},"Staci Gray [00:16:43]:",[14,2404,2405],{},"So I'm.",[14,2407,2408],{},"Staci Gray [00:16:45]:",[14,2410,2411],{},"Carrie's smirking. So I feel like I'm either hitting.",[14,2413,2414],{},"Kerry Guard [00:16:47]:",[14,2416,2417],{},"Something hard here, or I feel like you read our story somewhere or this is written down, or you were a fly on the wall through the last twelve years, we had all those things. We were definitely sharing the seat.",[14,2419,2420],{},"Kerry Guard [00:16:59]:",[14,2422,2423],{},"We were sharing the integrator seat for a long time.",[14,2425,2426],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:02]:",[14,2428,2429],{},"We didn't know it.",[14,2431,2432],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:03]:",[14,2434,2435],{},"So what happened was we were both doing everything.",[14,2437,2438],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:08]:",[14,2440,2441],{},"That's just what you do, right, when you first start off, you're both doing everything. We were showing up to client pitches together, we were putting presentations together, we were working on all the accounts together. We brought in as we were hiring, we were still account managing them and the analytics piece, and we were still very much working in the business together on everything. And so when it came time to.",[14,2443,2444],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:30]:",[14,2446,2447],{},"Like, figure out finance stuff or figure.",[14,2449,2450],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:32]:",[14,2452,2453],{},"Out marketing or figure out, you know, the it side of things, we were still doing it all together. And then I decided to go have children.",[14,2455,2456],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:41]:",[14,2458,2459],{},"And when I came back, it was.",[14,2461,2462],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:44]:",[14,2464,2465],{},"You know, Mike held up the fort for two and a half months or so while I had twins. And I came back and we had.",[14,2467,2468],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:52]:",[14,2470,2471],{},"A super tough conversation and a strong heart to heart of, like, one person.",[14,2473,2474],{},"Kerry Guard [00:17:59]:",[14,2476,2477],{},"Cannot all do this, and we've been doing everything.",[14,2479,2480],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:01]:",[14,2482,2483],{},"And so, like, where are we going from here?",[14,2485,2486],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:04]:",[14,2488,2489],{},"It was at that point that we split the roles and responsibilities based off of just our own capability of, like, to your point, like you said, Stacey, of like, where our strengths were. And so Mike's strengths was 100% sales. I came back, it was like the best problem to have coming off of maternity leave. We had way too much business, not enough people. Great problem to have. Oh, we were swimming in it. So I was like, Mike, you guys got the sales path, you're crushing it. And I said, I need to take the operations side and the people side, because now I got to go figure out, like, where people are going to come from to go staff.",[14,2491,2492],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:36]:",[14,2494,2495],{},"And then you take sales and I'll take marketing and then the finance piece as well.",[14,2497,2498],{},"Staci Gray [00:18:40]:",[14,2500,2501],{},"We sort of just like split the.",[14,2503,2504],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:42]:",[14,2506,2507],{},"House, divided it down the center.",[14,2509,2510],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:45]:",[14,2512,2513],{},"And that worked for a while.",[14,2515,2516],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:46]:",[14,2518,2519],{},"It worked from 2015 to 2021.",[14,2521,2522],{},"Staci Gray [00:18:50]:",[14,2524,2525],{},"21 ish.",[14,2527,2528],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:53]:",[14,2530,2531],{},"Yeah, 21 ish.",[14,2533,2534],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:54]:",[14,2536,2537],{},"And then we had a new heart to heart.",[14,2539,2540],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:57]:",[14,2542,2543],{},"And I'm gonna let Mike take it.",[14,2545,2546],{},"Kerry Guard [00:18:58]:",[14,2548,2549],{},"From here because he sort of sparked the switch chains and the winds.",[14,2551,2552],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:06]:",[14,2554,2555],{},"Yeah. Yeah. Stacey, you definitely are noticing some of the co ness of the role within integrator and visionary amongst Carrie and I. And, you know, where, where we were in about 2021 is, I was actually talking to an EOS coach or an implementer, whatever they call them, EOS implementation coach. And he was just asking some questions, and we hadn't even hired him yet.",[14,2557,2558],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:29]:",[14,2560,2561],{},"And he said, the more you tell.",[14,2563,2564],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:32]:",[14,2566,2567],{},"Me, the more I realize you're actually both sharing these seats on your accountability chart. Like, I'm not sure if you're aware.",[14,2569,2570],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:36]:",[14,2572,2573],{},"Of that, but you are.",[14,2575,2576],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:38]:",[14,2578,2579],{},"And it was kind of an aha moment for me where I was like.",[14,2581,2582],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:41]:",[14,2584,2585],{},"Oh, well, yeah, I mean, I guess.",[14,2587,2588],{},"Mike Krass [00:19:44]:",[14,2590,2591],{},"Like, I have been managing finance, but also big relationships and vision and those, like, I'm fine doing finance, but it's not like a, it's not a life giving activity for me. Like, I do it because I need to, because it's my responsibility as a business owner to understand what's happening here, but it's not like what I really enjoy with, you know, big relationships and vision and, and that kind of work.",[14,2593,2594],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:09]:",[14,2596,2597],{},"And so that conversation with Matt brought.",[14,2599,2600],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:12]:",[14,2602,2603],{},"About our conversation where I said, hey, I think we need to have another.",[14,2605,2606],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:15]:",[14,2608,2609],{},"Understanding of, like, we really were just.",[14,2611,2612],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:17]:",[14,2614,2615],{},"Picking up things based on who had time. Like, oh, well, Stacy's got an extra 2 hours in her week, so she can just do, like, the finance stuff because it takes about 2 hours a week. Perfect. But it's not actually what Stacy should be doing, or Mike or Carrie in this case.",[14,2617,2618],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:29]:",[14,2620,2621],{},"And so in 2020, when we had that conversation, we split and we really.",[14,2623,2624],{},"Mike Krass [00:20:33]:",[14,2626,2627],{},"Focused on integrator, visionary, who does what. There's still a little bit of crossover because as integrator. And Kerry also carries the CEO title, which is not always common for an integrator to have that title. And so, like, she is involved with some big relationships because she has to be, right? As CEO, she has to understand, like, where certain things are. But it's created a different space for me to act in a visionary role, which, as you probably know, Stacy doesn't necessarily have a beginning and the end. It's kind of like a big ball of yarn that just continues forever.",[14,2629,2630],{},"Mike Krass [00:21:04]:",[14,2632,2633],{},"You know, it's not like I'm gonna.",[14,2635,2636],{},"Mike Krass [00:21:05]:",[14,2638,2639],{},"Set 2 hours on Tuesday morning, and then the vision will be done. Like, the vision changes every single time I speak to somebody. It changes just a little bit.",[14,2641,2642],{},"Staci Gray [00:21:13]:",[14,2644,2645],{},"I joke, I have built several multi million dollar businesses as integrator, and then I did it as visionary in making the change from integrator to visionary was so hard for exactly what you just said, mike, because as an integrator, you win in checkboxes. Like, you're results oriented. It's logistics and all of that. You go to visionary role, and it's like you got one checkbox and it's just an unraveling yarn. And you keep thinking about it. It keeps evolving, and it's harder to contain. So it's a. Just because you have time on your calendar doesn't mean you have mental capacity.",[14,2647,2648],{},"Staci Gray [00:21:49]:",[14,2650,2651],{},"And that has been such a growth journey for me. The thing that you guys have done, even just explaining this, is the courage to have what I call pink elephant conversations. It's the uncomfortable conversation that everyone knows there's a pink elephant in the room, but everyone is just tiptoeing around it. And it's really hard to build and scale organizations without having those, because you forfeit trust every time you brush that thing under the rug. It fragments the relationship. So how did you guys inside of your organization create a culture of having crucial conversations?",[14,2653,2654],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:29]:",[14,2656,2657],{},"I think it comes back to our values, right? So it's such a critical part of any business.",[14,2659,2660],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:34]:",[14,2662,2663],{},"I know that all the people listening probably do have values, and I hope.",[14,2665,2666],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:38]:",[14,2668,2669],{},"That the values are more than just.",[14,2671,2672],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:41]:",[14,2674,2675],{},"Pretty pictures on the wall. Don't get me wrong, I love walking.",[14,2677,2678],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:44]:",[14,2680,2681],{},"Into an office building and see some awesome lettering with your values tattooed all over.",[14,2683,2684],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:48]:",[14,2686,2687],{},"It is super cool, but you also.",[14,2689,2690],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:50]:",[14,2692,2693],{},"Gotta live up to them. And I was never really part of an agency or company that did that.",[14,2695,2696],{},"Kerry Guard [00:22:56]:",[14,2698,2699],{},"Long duty, did have values, and they did say what they were, but I.",[14,2701,2702],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:00]:",[14,2704,2705],{},"Didn'T feel them through the organization. And so I think when Mike and I started MKG, it was really important.",[14,2707,2708],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:05]:",[14,2710,2711],{},"That when we created values, we really came back to living them.",[14,2713,2714],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:11]:",[14,2716,2717],{},"Every decision we make comes back to, is this people first?",[14,2719,2720],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:15]:",[14,2722,2723],{},"Is this transparent?",[14,2725,2726],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:17]:",[14,2728,2729],{},"Is this laddering up to the bigger picture? And is this upholding our standards that we've worked so hard to create thus far?",[14,2731,2732],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:26]:",[14,2734,2735],{},"And so transparency is one of our values. And crucial conversations happen in that place of honesty, of, like, let's sit with.",[14,2737,2738],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:36]:",[14,2740,2741],{},"The ugly truths of where we are and what's happening and then have a discussion around. I think ids really helped with that.",[14,2743,2744],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:42]:",[14,2746,2747],{},"You know, what's the issue?",[14,2749,2750],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:44]:",[14,2752,2753],{},"Let's discuss it to really make sure we know it and understand it and we've defined it, because what you think the issue is is probably not what.",[14,2755,2756],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:52]:",[14,2758,2759],{},"The actual issue is, and then let's solve it.",[14,2761,2762],{},"Kerry Guard [00:23:56]:",[14,2764,2765],{},"And so I think in really being able to embed ids into our organization really helped us have those pink elephant conversations a lot easier. It was not pretty in the early days. It was very much ripping off a band aid. It was very much saying hurtful things because we didn't know what else. We didn't know how to just start the conversation. And I think now that we use.",[14,2767,2768],{},"Kerry Guard [00:24:20]:",[14,2770,2771],{},"The ids framework, it's really helped being.",[14,2773,2774],{},"Kerry Guard [00:24:22]:",[14,2776,2777],{},"Able to have those conversations faster.",[14,2779,2780],{},"Staci Gray [00:24:25]:",[14,2782,2783],{},"And for folks who maybe don't know, ids is issue, discuss, solve, and it's part of a weekly leadership meeting or every other week leadership meeting from eos.",[14,2785,2786],{},"Mike Krass [00:24:37]:",[14,2788,2789],{},"One thing I'd say that, you know.",[14,2791,2792],{},"Mike Krass [00:24:38]:",[14,2794,2795],{},"Kerry, you just mentioned is, and these.",[14,2797,2798],{},"Mike Krass [00:24:41]:",[14,2800,2801],{},"Are my words, but what you just mentioned brought this to the forefront of my mind is we didn't know how to have these conversations. So for the listeners, it's not like we just showed up. And on our first day of partnership.",[14,2803,2804],{},"Mike Krass [00:24:53]:",[14,2806,2807],{},"At being in a partnership in the business, we just knew how to have them.",[14,2809,2810],{},"Mike Krass [00:24:57]:",[14,2812,2813],{},"And I remember when Carrie came back from having the twins and I was still in flight training. Every Friday morning I'd go to San Carlos airport. It's just like 5 miles south of SFO in San Francisco. And we'd have our weekly meeting after I do a flight lesson with an instructor.",[14,2815,2816],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:14]:",[14,2818,2819],{},"And I remember distinctly and in a.",[14,2821,2822],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:18]:",[14,2824,2825],{},"Horrible way because I didn't have the language or any of the tools, essentially.",[14,2827,2828],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:22]:",[14,2830,2831],{},"Saying, like, I'm doing a whole lot.",[14,2833,2834],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:24]:",[14,2836,2837],{},"Around here and I don't know what the heck is going on with you, but, like, I need help. And Harry having two twins, you know, very young children, for any listeners who have had young children, you know, like, that first year and the first couple months is hard. And what you don't probably need someone to say is, hey, man, like, what's going on with you? And so I just said it in the most horrible way. It was a conversation that needed to happen, but it was from my side, just, like, delivered terribly.",[14,2839,2840],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:55]:",[14,2842,2843],{},"And now you fast forward.",[14,2845,2846],{},"Mike Krass [00:25:56]:",[14,2848,2849],{},"That's in 2015. It's now 2024. So almost a decade later. And we have tools that have been given to us like ids from the attraction or EOS framework. We've got, you know, a business coach who talks to us about having crucial conversations and how to start conversations. So it's almost like training, right? Almost like a sport, right?",[14,2851,2852],{},"Mike Krass [00:26:14]:",[14,2854,2855],{},"Like nobody, nobody just gave Roger Federer a tennis racket, and they were like.",[14,2857,2858],{},"Mike Krass [00:26:18]:",[14,2860,2861],{},"Hey, man, go win. Like, a pile of grand slams, right? It required, like, training and coaching and practice and some terrible, terrible matches, both in our business and in his tennis career to understand, like, what's going on here, like, what's happening. And so it's that phrase of, like, the only way out is through. Like, you cannot go around this. Like, that's avoiding the conversation. Like, the way forward is through, and it's going to be messy, and you're probably going to make some mistakes. And insight is 2020, but ultimately, it's having these tools to be able to have, in your words, crucial conversations.",[14,2863,2864],{},"Staci Gray [00:26:52]:",[14,2866,2867],{},"That's also a book called Crucial Conversations, which is incredible if you guys haven't read it. The thing that you also have done for each other is extend a lot of grace and also show a commitment. You know, sometimes when we reach those really hard moments in partnerships and a visionary integrator relationship can very much be like a marriage because you're committed to this person, you're working through everything with them.",[14,2869,2870],{},"Staci Gray [00:27:20]:",[14,2872,2873],{},"It's. You're.",[14,2875,2876],{},"Staci Gray [00:27:21]:",[14,2878,2879],{},"You're triggering each other.",[14,2881,2882],{},"Kerry Guard [00:27:23]:",[14,2884,2885],{},"And so we have a process we.",[14,2887,2888],{},"Staci Gray [00:27:24]:",[14,2890,2891],{},"Call find your truth in the trigger. Because what you're sharing is your narrative. It's your story. It's what you're telling yourself about the facts. But the root of it is something deeper. Like, I'm feeling like this is inequitable, or I am feeling like I am doing things I don't enjoy, and you get to do all the things you do enjoy, and being able to share it from a place of, you know, we both want win win, which it sounds like you guys have very much gone on that journey. The other part of the dynamic that I'm really curious about, and, Carrie, you alluded it to it in the beginning, which was, it was really just like a gut instinct. Like, you knew it was your intuition.",[14,2893,2894],{},"Staci Gray [00:28:07]:",[14,2896,2897],{},"And women, I think, tend to have these visceral reactions. I think men do, too, but women tend to be okay talking about it. And I know, Carrie, you're big Brene Brown. Fran, as I am, too. And I'm sure you brought that into the culture and the leadership and dynamic. But has there been any wrestling with that? Because I know I've had that where I've told my integrator, hey, this doesn't feel right. And unless it feels right and passionate and aligned, I don't think I can move in this direction. But someone who's integrator, like, who's more logical and systematic and if then.",[14,2899,2900],{},"Staci Gray [00:28:43]:",[14,2902,2903],{},"And engineer thinking, it's like, this makes no sense. It's obvious we should do this. So how do you guys reconcile some of that, if that happens in your relationship at all?",[14,2905,2906],{},"Kerry Guard [00:28:53]:",[14,2908,2909],{},"I go off of hunches and gut feelings based off of facts and data from previous. So I am very much that logical thinker.",[14,2911,2912],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:03]:",[14,2914,2915],{},"I'm not.",[14,2917,2918],{},"Staci Gray [00:29:04]:",[14,2920,2921],{},"That's why?",[14,2923,2924],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:05]:",[14,2926,2927],{},"Like, I'm not the visionary. I can't really think ten steps ahead. I'm thinking about right now and how.",[14,2929,2930],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:12]:",[14,2932,2933],{},"To make right now great.",[14,2935,2936],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:14]:",[14,2938,2939],{},"And with, you know, really looking at.",[14,2941,2942],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:17]:",[14,2944,2945],{},"That year to three year plan, like.",[14,2947,2948],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:19]:",[14,2950,2951],{},"That'S about as far ahead as I can think. And so my gut reactions, my hunches.",[14,2953,2954],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:25]:",[14,2956,2957],{},"Are all based off of the information I'm gathering through my subconscious. And so I think when I met Mike, it was twofold. One, I saw me and him. I was that horse in New York. I I was owning the Yoplay account.",[14,2959,2960],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:48]:",[14,2962,2963],{},"For $10 million, and it was me.",[14,2965,2966],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:51]:",[14,2968,2969],{},"And I reported to a VP, and it burned me.",[14,2971,2972],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:55]:",[14,2974,2975],{},"So when I showed up and saw Mike, I was like, I feel you so hard.",[14,2977,2978],{},"Kerry Guard [00:29:59]:",[14,2980,2981],{},"Can't even tell you. And what was magical about it.",[14,2983,2984],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:05]:",[14,2986,2987],{},"And you don't run into many of these people, especially in New York City. Gosh, you do not run into these.",[14,2989,2990],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:08]:",[14,2992,2993],{},"People in New York City. Is that people who can take feedback and run with it and lean into.",[14,2995,2996],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:14]:",[14,2998,2999],{},"It and are like, tell me you're giving me great suggestions on what I could be doing better. Like, let's go.",[14,3001,3002],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:20]:",[14,3004,3005],{},"Right?",[14,3007,3002],{},[14,3009,3010],{},"And he was one of those people.",[14,3012,3013],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:21]:",[14,3015,3016],{},"Where I was like, we could grow together.",[14,3018,3019],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:24]:",[14,3021,3022],{},"Like, we hear from each other, we build off of each other. It's rare that you find people to do that with where you don't get.",[14,3024,3025],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:31]:",[14,3027,3028],{},"It's more of a yes and versus a no. But. And so I think when we're.",[14,3030,3031],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:39]:",[14,3033,3034],{},"For me, it was very much like I was going on that gut feeling based off of all these past relationships that I had throughout New York. So when I. When I met Mike, I just. That's how I knew it was based.",[14,3036,3037],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:52]:",[14,3039,3040],{},"Off of all that information. And so I think for us moving.",[14,3042,3043],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:56]:",[14,3045,3046],{},"Forward, it is very much where Mike.",[14,3048,3049],{},"Kerry Guard [00:30:58]:",[14,3051,3052],{},"Can think a bit higher level.",[14,3054,3055],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:00]:",[14,3057,3058],{},"He can keep his pulse on the bigger picture.",[14,3060,3061],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:02]:",[14,3063,3064],{},"He can pull me up to say, I hear, like, you know, I know.",[14,3066,3067],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:07]:",[14,3069,3070],{},"That this decision is really hard. I know that it might go against our values of what that feels like right now, but at the end of.",[14,3072,3073],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:12]:",[14,3075,3076],{},"The day, this is what needs to.",[14,3078,3079],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:14]:",[14,3081,3082],{},"Be accomplished, and we need to. We need to find our way through in what that decision is going to.",[14,3084,3085],{},"Staci Gray [00:31:18]:",[14,3087,3088],{},"Be to get there.",[14,3090,3091],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:19]:",[14,3093,3094],{},"And so I think we work really.",[14,3096,3097],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:23]:",[14,3099,3100],{},"Well that way of him being able to see big picture and me being.",[14,3102,3103],{},"Kerry Guard [00:31:26]:",[14,3105,3106],{},"Like, the right now problems of right now.",[14,3108,3109],{},"Staci Gray [00:31:30]:",[14,3111,3112],{},"Mm hmm.",[14,3114,3115],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:32]:",[14,3117,1808],{},[14,3119,3115],{},[14,3121,3122],{},"I I would talk about, you know.",[14,3124,3125],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:35]:",[14,3127,3128],{},"To the listeners, the having a framework.",[14,3130,3131],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:38]:",[14,3133,3134],{},"And understanding what conversation we're having. So, like, a piece of language that.",[14,3136,3137],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:43]:",[14,3139,3140],{},"I have that I've had to change.",[14,3142,3143],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:45]:",[14,3145,3146],{},"Because my wife doesn't like this anymore.",[14,3148,3149],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:47]:",[14,3151,3152],{},"And doesn't respond in a way that she likes to. It is, are we talking?",[14,3154,3155],{},"Mike Krass [00:31:54]:",[14,3157,3158],{},"Am I listening or are we solving something here? Anything about, like a systems thinker, like an integrator can often be.",[14,3160,3161],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:02]:",[14,3163,3164],{},"And it's like the moment I say.",[14,3166,3167],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:04]:",[14,3169,3170],{},"Something as a visionary and integrator will be like, well, let's see, like, how could we operationalize this?",[14,3172,3173],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:09]:",[14,3175,3176],{},"We can do this, that. And so framing it in a way.",[14,3178,3179],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:12]:",[14,3181,3182],{},"Of like, hey, I just want to carry's going to laugh at this because I think my latest version is like, I just want to plant a seed, which I didn't realize I said that so often. And she actually reflected it back to me earlier this year. She's like, you plant a lot of seeds of thought, an idea. And I'm like, I guess I do. I never thought about that. But that's basically saying because the language I used to use was, I'm going to tell you something, but I don't want to talk about it right now, which is, like, very frustrating to somebody who wants to operationalize something. And I think I said it last week, so I still say it on occasion, but it's like going to plant the seed of this idea. And I also, I do my best to offer an outlet.",[14,3184,3185],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:50]:",[14,3187,3188],{},"So, like, every Thursday morning we have a non IDS meeting, just Kerry and I, not our leadership team. It's just the two of us for 50 minutes.",[14,3190,3191],{},"Mike Krass [00:32:58]:",[14,3193,3194],{},"And so I often will plant seeds.",[14,3196,3197],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:01]:",[14,3199,3200],{},"At the beginning of the week so Carrie can think about them and then we can have time to talk about them and we might just jump straight into operationalizing it. That non ids block of time turns.",[14,3202,3203],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:10]:",[14,3205,3206],{},"Into ids real quick sometimes, but it's.",[14,3208,3209],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:13]:",[14,3211,3212],{},"Framing it of, like, here's how I'm.",[14,3214,3215],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:15]:",[14,3217,3218],{},"Bringing this to you.",[14,3220,3221],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:16]:",[14,3223,3224],{},"And for me, like, how I felt like, like, right in here sometimes is I'd like, bring this idea to Carrie.",[14,3226,3227],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:22]:",[14,3229,3230],{},"And then she start operationalizing it and.",[14,3232,3233],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:25]:",[14,3235,3236],{},"I'd be like, I don't know, like, I don't think we're even ready for that or whatever. And so it's kind of like, you know, you put the car in drive and then you, like, put it back in park. And so everyone's just like, what are we doing here, guys? Like, what the heck?",[14,3238,3239],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:36]:",[14,3241,3242],{},"But it's not everyone. It's two people.",[14,3244,3245],{},"Staci Gray [00:33:38]:",[14,3247,3248],{},"Yes.",[14,3250,3251],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:38]:",[14,3253,3254],{},"Being like, what the heck is happening around here?",[14,3256,3257],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:41]:",[14,3259,3260],{},"So I've tried to find that, like, that language and that framing of here.",[14,3262,3263],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:45]:",[14,3265,3266],{},"I'm just gonna, like, share some ideas.",[14,3268,3269],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:47]:",[14,3271,3272],{},"And I'm not sure that I'm ready.",[14,3274,3275],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:49]:",[14,3277,3278],{},"That can also be another piece of language of, like, I'm not sure I'm ready. Like, I'm here to listen if you.",[14,3280,3281],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:53]:",[14,3283,3284],{},"Want to talk about it, but I'm not really ready to go further right now. I can listen, but I don't know.",[14,3286,3287],{},"Mike Krass [00:33:59]:",[14,3289,3290],{},"That I can contribute as a speaker right now.",[14,3292,3293],{},"Staci Gray [00:34:03]:",[14,3295,3296],{},"One of the things I learned so much about the visionary integrator dynamic, which you guys are modeling here is the need for thought partnership, and with it not necessarily being actionable, because I know my integrator comes to me and says, what do you think about all of this? And I'm like, that's so in the weeds. Like, I can't go there right now. But at the same time, they're coming because they're like, I want to make sure that the vision is fully represented operationally, and I want to just double check and make sure we're aligned. And then when I'm in the visionary role, I'm like, hey, could we actually operationalize this? Would this actually resonate with our customers? I need, like, boots on the ground insight into this and that thought partnership. I didn't realize until more recently how critical that was for visionary integrator relationships to be successful. So framing it instead of chasing multiple rabbits is so critical. Yet sometimes we don't self regulate in that fashion. Especially, I'll say, more in the visionary seat than the integrator.",[14,3298,3299],{},"Staci Gray [00:35:12]:",[14,3301,3302],{},"The integrators tends to be more like three to five years right in front of you. More disciplined with our thinking visionaries in the seat.",[14,3304,3305],{},"Kerry Guard [00:35:21]:",[14,3307,3308],{},"That seat.",[14,3310,3311],{},"Staci Gray [00:35:21]:",[14,3313,3314],{},"We didn't get lost in the clouds and sometimes lose. Lose sense of reality or practicality at times. And the integrator can feel like they're poking holes in it. So, Carrie, do you have tactics that you use to support Mike in thought partnership without him feeling like his ideas.",[14,3316,3317],{},"Staci Gray [00:35:41]:",[14,3319,3320],{},"Are being dismissed or pooh poohed?",[14,3322,3323],{},"Kerry Guard [00:35:46]:",[14,3325,3326],{},"It took me a really long time.",[14,3328,3329],{},"Kerry Guard [00:35:49]:",[14,3331,3332],{},"To give space, to give space to.",[14,3334,3335],{},"Kerry Guard [00:35:53]:",[14,3337,3338],{},"An idea and let my subconscious hang out. So it's the.",[14,3340,3341],{},"Kerry Guard [00:35:56]:",[14,3343,3344],{},"It's giving space.",[14,3346,3347],{},"Staci Gray [00:35:58]:",[14,3349,3350],{},"Giving space for your subconscious to marinate on an idea. And I feel like that put it in a box really well, because sometimes we take an idea in the integrator seat, especially take the idea and run with it.",[14,3352,3353],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:13]:",[14,3355,3356],{},"Don't need to. I don't need to integrate every single idea he has all the time. Sometimes he just has ideas and he needs to say them, and I need to give him space to say them. Love my subconscious. Hang out with them, and then there's gonna be one or two that I say, okay, I see it. I gotta see. I call them lily pads, right?",[14,3358,3359],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:30]:",[14,3361,3362],{},"So, like, I don't want to not.",[14,3364,3365],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:32]:",[14,3367,3368],{},"Say no to an idea. I just can't quite see the lily pads yet. So I'm just gonna hang out with it. And then the minute I can see the lily pads, it's like. And then I'm like, okay, let's dig into this and figure out what this means and how this might impact the company in a bigger way. So it's those two things.",[14,3370,3371],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:45]:",[14,3373,3374],{},"Between the giving of the space and.",[14,3376,3377],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:48]:",[14,3379,3380],{},"Acknowledging to myself that I don't need.",[14,3382,3383],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:51]:",[14,3385,3386],{},"To integrate every idea, he's going to.",[14,3388,3389],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:53]:",[14,3391,3392],{},"Have a million ideas.",[14,3394,3395],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:54]:",[14,3397,3398],{},"That's his job.",[14,3400,3401],{},"Kerry Guard [00:36:56]:",[14,3403,3404],{},"It's my job to figure out which ideas are the ones we can use right now.",[14,3406,3407],{},"Staci Gray [00:37:00]:",[14,3409,3248],{},[14,3411,3412],{},"Staci Gray [00:37:02]:",[14,3414,3415],{},"One of the integrators I know will ask the visionary. Okay, of the five ideas you just told me about, which one of these are you going to change your mind about tomorrow? And then they just start going down their fingers and I'm like, that's brilliant. I need to use that. So what are you guys most excited about? Now that your versionary integrator relationship is just stormed and formed and you're really getting each other? That's where magic happens. So what's the future?",[14,3417,3418],{},"Staci Gray [00:37:31]:",[14,3420,3421],{},"Hold on.",[14,3423,3424],{},"Kerry Guard [00:37:33]:",[14,3426,3427],{},"I think it took us a minute to get acclimated.",[14,3429,3430],{},"Kerry Guard [00:37:37]:",[14,3432,3433],{},"So a couple things happened, right? So I took over CEO. The importance of me taking the CEO seat and really sitting an integrator as one person versus splitting is that now one person can see all the different pillars of the organization and how they fit together. Before, Mike was sales and finance, and he saw that and I was like, cool, I'm just going to go ask for money whenever I need it from a marketing and operations standpoint.",[14,3435,3436],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:04]:",[14,3438,3439],{},"But we weren't, because we weren't working together.",[14,3441,3442],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:06]:",[14,3444,3445],{},"There wasn't one person who could see the through line on that. Then we got out of balance. And so it really took me probably the last two years to really be able to see the full organization and how all these pillars work. Look at the historical data and. And think about how the market has changed and then what we're going to do from here based off of that information.",[14,3447,3448],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:27]:",[14,3450,3451],{},"And I finally feel like I get it.",[14,3453,3454],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:32]:",[14,3456,3457],{},"It's ever changing. And I'm, you know, but I feel caught up. And so I think it took us.",[14,3459,3460],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:39]:",[14,3462,3463],{},"The last two years. We also, I mean, I think a.",[14,3465,3466],{},"Kerry Guard [00:38:42]:",[14,3468,3469],{},"Lot of agencies are feeling this up and down in terms of how the market's operating and it's been a tough two years. So we've been in a bit of fight or flight, but we're coming out the other side. 2024 has, you know, set us up for success in terms of where we are in trajectory of our finances. And so I think we're in a really good spot now to like give Mike those wings and that breath, to.",[14,3471,3472],{},"Kerry Guard [00:39:02]:",[14,3474,3475],{},"Like, go really live in that visionary role.",[14,3477,3478],{},"Kerry Guard [00:39:05]:",[14,3480,3481],{},"We haven't really had a chance to give him that and he's starting to find his feet in it.",[14,3483,3484],{},"Staci Gray [00:39:10]:",[14,3486,3487],{},"And it's, it's exciting to think about.",[14,3489,3490],{},"Kerry Guard [00:39:14]:",[14,3492,3493],{},"Now that we have the space to think about it.",[14,3495,3496],{},"Kerry Guard [00:39:16]:",[14,3498,3499],{},"He has a space to think about it.",[14,3501,3502],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:19]:",[14,3504,1808],{},[14,3506,3507],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:20]:",[14,3509,3510],{},"And where we're going from a visionary.",[14,3512,3513],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:22]:",[14,3515,3516],{},"Standpoint, somebody wise told me, when you.",[14,3518,3519],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:26]:",[14,3521,3522],{},"Want to be going somewhere, you have to know where you're starting from.",[14,3524,3525],{},"Staci Gray [00:39:28]:",[14,3527,3005],{},[14,3529,3530],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:28]:",[14,3532,3533],{},"Like, there always has to be like us. You are here, button on your map. And I think where we are today, where we have been is focused on primarily running a traditional agency model. There's nothing wrong with it being traditional in the agency model. It's been great for us over the past twelve years.",[14,3535,3536],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:47]:",[14,3538,3539],{},"And where I see us going is.",[14,3541,3542],{},"Mike Krass [00:39:50]:",[14,3544,3545],{},"Behaving differently than a traditional agency. So like a traditional agency, you know, you do some marketing and selling and then you get a client and then you sign them and then they pay you and then you do the work. And on occasion you turn a few and you bring a few more in and it's fine. Right? There's nothing wrong with that. But where I am thinking from a.",[14,3547,3548],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:08]:",[14,3550,3551],{},"Vision standpoint is we need some sort.",[14,3553,3554],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:10]:",[14,3556,3557],{},"Of compounding, compounding effect to make the business compound. So it's not just linear, it's not just one and one is two. It's one and one can become 50.",[14,3559,3560],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:21]:",[14,3562,3563],{},"And that's where I see us going.",[14,3565,3566],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:24]:",[14,3568,3569],{},"Is behaving a little bit less an advertising or a marketing agency and more.",[14,3571,3572],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:29]:",[14,3574,3575],{},"Like a group of specialists. So, like a great example that I.",[14,3577,3578],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:33]:",[14,3580,3581],{},"Gave to Kerry the other day is like, if we're a building, like in a condo building, we have as an agency. And I know we'll tell your listeners at the end kind of what we.",[14,3583,3584],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:42]:",[14,3586,3587],{},"Do and who we work with.",[14,3589,3590],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:43]:",[14,3592,3593],{},"We have a specific focus in terms of services and the type of customer we want to work with.",[14,3595,3596],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:48]:",[14,3598,3599],{},"And that's great.",[14,3601,3596],{},[14,3603,3604],{},"It's really solid positioning.",[14,3606,3607],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:50]:",[14,3609,3610],{},"It helps people.",[14,3612,3613],{},"Mike Krass [00:40:52]:",[14,3615,3616],{},"It's magnetic, it draws certain people in and it repels others. But there are certain things we don't do. There are other capabilities we'd love to have. I see for our vision this condo building of individual condo units of specialties. And what gets lost a lot, I was just talking to somebody two weeks ago who's selling his marketing agency and what gets lost a lot in an.",[14,3618,3619],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:13]:",[14,3621,3622],{},"Acquisition, as one example, is you get.",[14,3624,3625],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:16]:",[14,3627,3628],{},"Folded into the mothership and the thing that made you special, that made you valuable, that people acquired you for, that.",[14,3630,3631],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:22]:",[14,3633,3634],{},"People wanted to work at and people wanted to hire, kind of becomes like.",[14,3636,3637],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:27]:",[14,3639,3640],{},"Glazed over into like one big mothership. And so like our vision that I see and it's taken a long time.",[14,3642,3643],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:34]:",[14,3645,3646],{},"To get to this vision is the.",[14,3648,3649],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:36]:",[14,3651,3652],{},"Condo building with these individual condo units of specialization. Because that's where we really think, that's where the compounding benefits will come is.",[14,3654,3655],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:45]:",[14,3657,3658],{},"A diverse set of capabilities but not.",[14,3660,3661],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:47]:",[14,3663,3664],{},"Mushed together into one mothership. And they're all specialized and they're all focused on our audience of software and cybersecurity marketers. And so that's, that's where I see us going and it's been really exciting to get there.",[14,3666,3667],{},"Mike Krass [00:41:59]:",[14,3669,3670],{},"And it's actually good timing to record.",[14,3672,3673],{},"Mike Krass [00:42:00]:",[14,3675,3676],{},"This because we literally just got there in the past few weeks. Like this is very new to us.",[14,3678,3679],{},"Staci Gray [00:42:05]:",[14,3681,3682],{},"Yeah, I think that's like having an umbrella organization with silos that are specialized is so helpful, especially in service based businesses because it's so nuanced per customer that you're working with. And then you can have underneath all of your software tech platforms, your tech stack that you either have in house or affiliates and then that becomes such a great model with your services being very boutique and custom and tailored and the software is the part that scales it for you. So I love that structure.",[14,3684,3685],{},"Kerry Guard [00:42:42]:",[14,3687,3688],{},"How would you guys define success?",[14,3690,3691],{},"Staci Gray [00:42:46]:",[14,3693,3694],{},"Not business, but individually? I know you guys did your, yeah, I think I would call it an MoU, but Kerry, you called it some formation agreement. This is what we're doing. What does that look like for you.",[14,3696,3697],{},"Kerry Guard [00:42:59]:",[14,3699,3700],{},"When this is all said and done.",[14,3702,3703],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:01]:",[14,3705,3706],{},"What a success looks like to me?",[14,3708,3709],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:04]:",[14,3711,3712],{},"So first of all, I don't see.",[14,3714,3715],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:08]:",[14,3717,3718],{},"Mkg as something that will be done. I see it as something that probably I will perish. My vision is I will perish before the organization does in whatever format the organization is at that time. So it's just this constant state of evolution.",[14,3720,3721],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:26]:",[14,3723,3724],{},"And I haven't done it this year.",[14,3726,3727],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:28]:",[14,3729,3730],{},"But actually this time last year I.",[14,3732,3733],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:30]:",[14,3735,3736],{},"Wrote myself an email of what does MKG do for me?",[14,3738,3739],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:34]:",[14,3741,3742],{},"And it really was some of the things that you just asked about, what does success look like?",[14,3744,3745],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:38]:",[14,3747,3748],{},"So success to me looks like flexibility.",[14,3750,3751],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:41]:",[14,3753,3754],{},"In work, location, and time, success looks like being able to travel for work, but not having to travel for work.",[14,3756,3757],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:48]:",[14,3759,3760],{},"Success looks like being able to volunteer.",[14,3762,3763],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:51]:",[14,3765,3766],{},"Which I'm trying to get back into. And it's kind of been slow going since COVID you know, everything kind of shut down in person. I really enjoy, like, in person volunteering.",[14,3768,3769],{},"Mike Krass [00:43:58]:",[14,3771,3772],{},"And success, to me, also looks like.",[14,3774,3775],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:03]:",[14,3777,3778],{},"I'll tell you what it doesn't look like. There isn't a number that I have. You know, a lot of entrepreneurs have a number. Like, if you're a 4% rural person, you're like, I just need to make $10 million, and then I can live on my brokerage account for the rest of my life and not have to do anything, which is all well and.",[14,3780,3781],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:15]:",[14,3783,3784],{},"Good until you meet somebody who's made.",[14,3786,3787],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:17]:",[14,3789,3790],{},"$10 million and they are living a 4% life, and they're like, dude, I'm so bored. I am like, I'm literally, like, punching holes in the wall so I have something to do during the day so I can, like, do drywall work. Like, I'm floating drywall just because I've got nothing else to do around here. So what it doesn't look like is.",[14,3792,3793],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:35]:",[14,3795,3796],{},"For me, it's not a number for me, it doesn't really have an end.",[14,3798,3799],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:38]:",[14,3801,3802],{},"And I think coming back to, you know, talking about the holding company and the condo building and the units within it, it's this evolution of what the offering is here at MKg. Like, MKG could be the overarching condo building. That's what's on the building of the sign. There's all these little condo units within it.",[14,3804,3805],{},"Mike Krass [00:44:56]:",[14,3807,3808],{},"And that evolution will have to be.",[14,3810,3811],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:00]:",[14,3813,3814],{},"Flexible because we don't even know what we're gonna. What we're gonna need in ten years, right? I don't even know what condo units are gonna be in that building at that point. It could be the same. It could be different. It could be a mix.",[14,3816,3817],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:11]:",[14,3819,3820],{},"So, like, for me, I look at.",[14,3822,3823],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:13]:",[14,3825,3826],{},"It as maximum flexibility.",[14,3828,3829],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:15]:",[14,3831,3832],{},"It's not about a number. It's more about a lifestyle without it.",[14,3834,3835],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:19]:",[14,3837,3838],{},"Being a lifestyle business, if that makes sense.",[14,3840,3841],{},"Staci Gray [00:45:23]:",[14,3843,3844],{},"What I'm hearing, and I think I've heard it almost throughout this whole conversation, is just.",[14,3846,3847],{},"Kerry Guard [00:45:29]:",[14,3849,3850],{},"It's almost a value of joy.",[14,3852,3853],{},"Staci Gray [00:45:31]:",[14,3855,3856],{},"Like, enjoying the process, enjoying the discovery, enjoying envisioning, enjoying the evolution, enjoying learning how to have crucial conversations.",[14,3858,3859],{},"Kerry Guard [00:45:43]:",[14,3861,3862],{},"It's the process that's such a beautiful way to approach it.",[14,3864,3865],{},"Staci Gray [00:45:48]:",[14,3867,1808],{},[14,3869,3870],{},"Mike Krass [00:45:49]:",[14,3872,3873],{},"Very John Wooden esque. When you frame it that way of, like, it's not about what's the scoreboard. It's about how you tie your shoes but how you run about like. It's about the process.",[14,3875,3876],{},"Staci Gray [00:45:58]:",[14,3878,1808],{},[14,3880,3881],{},"Staci Gray [00:45:59]:",[14,3883,3884],{},"How about for you, Carrie?",[14,3886,3887],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:01]:",[14,3889,3890],{},"I'm with Mike.",[14,3892,3893],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:02]:",[14,3895,3896],{},"We read the book by Simon Sneck of let's start with why it was the infinite game.",[14,3898,3899],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:08]:",[14,3901,3902],{},"The infinite game.",[14,3904,3905],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:09]:",[14,3907,3908],{},"And so in reading that book, that's where it came for me of like, this is a painting that's never going to be done and I am going.",[14,3910,3911],{},"Staci Gray [00:46:15]:",[14,3913,3914],{},"To sit and accept that and be.",[14,3916,3917],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:17]:",[14,3919,3920],{},"Excited about what this could mean for.",[14,3922,3923],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:20]:",[14,3925,3926],{},"The next generation of who will take this thing over and keep it going. That's super exciting for me. I think that's what success looks like. The idea of it continuing without micro writing and sort of our legacy. I called it a legacy the other.",[14,3928,3929],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:33]:",[14,3931,3932],{},"Day and my husband was like, legacy? I've been doing this for twelve years.",[14,3934,3935],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:38]:",[14,3937,3938],{},"Like, I don't see myself really doing anything else. So yeah, my kids are going to remember my career as MPG and the legacy I leave behind for the next generation to take it over. And so, yeah, I think for me it's right now in terms of success, I'm looking for that stability and sustainability.",[14,3940,3941],{},"Kerry Guard [00:46:56]:",[14,3943,3944],{},"Piece for it to grow into that legacy. That's beautiful.",[14,3946,3947],{},"Staci Gray [00:47:01]:",[14,3949,3950],{},"You guys are finding your eyes closed reasons for doing eyes open things that.",[14,3952,3953],{},"Kerry Guard [00:47:06]:",[14,3955,3956],{},"Are beyond your time on earth, which is beautiful. I love it.",[14,3958,3959],{},"Staci Gray [00:47:11]:",[14,3961,3962],{},"So if folks want to learn more.",[14,3964,3965],{},"Kerry Guard [00:47:13]:",[14,3967,3968],{},"About what you do, maybe can you.",[14,3970,3971],{},"Staci Gray [00:47:16]:",[14,3973,3974],{},"All share a little bit about that and then where people can connect with you?",[14,3976,3977],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:21]:",[14,3979,3980],{},"Certainly.",[14,3982,3983],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:22]:",[14,3985,3986],{},"So we're easy to find online. The company is called MKG Marketing. Mike Kilo Golf Marketing. And you can go to MkG Marketing. Just type that into your browser and it'll take you straight to our website. Kerry and I are also both power LinkedIn ers. So I think probably in the show notes we can hook Stacy up with our LinkedIn profiles. We would love for anybody to connect.",[14,3988,3989],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:45]:",[14,3991,3992],{},"With us who heard the episode wants.",[14,3994,3995],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:48]:",[14,3997,3998],{},"To talk about anything we discussed or anything we left out. That's really the easiest way to get ahold of us is hit the website.",[14,4000,4001],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:54]:",[14,4003,4004],{},"Hit us on LinkedIn. And if you are a software or.",[14,4006,4007],{},"Mike Krass [00:47:58]:",[14,4009,4010],{},"A cybersecurity marketer listening to this, that's our niche, that's where MKG works. So we would absolutely love to meet you. If there's an opportunity to work together, great. More importantly, just to expand our network and our world. Carrie, anything that I left out there?",[14,4012,4013],{},"Staci Gray [00:48:10]:",[14,4015,4016],{},"If you are looking for marketing tips.",[14,4018,4019],{},"Kerry Guard [00:48:12]:",[14,4021,4022],{},"And tricks, we do have a podcast, tea time with tech marketing leaders that I host. So many great demand gen marketers on there who are building businesses and have great ideas on how to help you do it. So definitely check that out and if you're a marketer in b two B.",[14,4024,4025],{},"Kerry Guard [00:48:28]:",[14,4027,4028],{},"In the tech space and SaaS or cyber and you want to be on the show, let me know.",[14,4030,4031],{},"Staci Gray [00:48:31]:",[14,4033,4034],{},"Love to have you.",[14,4036,4037],{},"Staci Gray [00:48:33]:",[14,4039,4040],{},"Love that you I don't know why anyone would not want to connect with you both because you are soulful leaders and I feel like the world is really needing a lot more soulful leaders and bringing bringing more joy into the.",[14,4042,4043],{},"Staci Gray [00:48:45]:",[14,4045,4046],{},"Workplace while you get things done because like Mike you said the guy who retired 4% you get bored. People want to do things because that makes them feel significant and valued that create more beautiful things in the world. So I just appreciate both of you and admire the visionary integrated relationship with.",[14,4048,4049],{},"Staci Gray [00:49:08]:",[14,4051,4052],{},"Thank you so much for joining the conversation today.",[14,4054,4055],{},"Kerry Guard [00:49:11]:",[14,4057,4058],{},"Thank you Stacey. Thanks for having us.",[14,4060,4061],{},"Staci Gray [00:49:14]:",[14,4063,4064],{},"Yes. Yeah.",[14,4066,4067],{},"Mike Krass [00:49:15]:",[14,4069,4070],{},"Thank you.",[1510,4072],{},{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4074},[4075,4076,4077,4078,4079],{"id":1479,"depth":291,"text":1482},{"id":1488,"depth":291,"text":1491},{"id":1508,"depth":291,"text":1514},{"id":77,"depth":291,"text":77},{"id":1529,"depth":291,"text":1532},"industry","2024-04-19T20:18:05Z","Kerry Guard & Mike Krass discuss their entrepreneurial journey and partnership at MKG Marketing, highlighting their roles, challenges, and shared vision.",{"_schema":4084},"default",49,"\u002Fblog\u002Findustry\u002Fbuilding-trust-and-respect-crucial-convos-for-a-profitable-partnership",{"title":1472,"description":4082},"blog\u002Findustry\u002Fbuilding-trust-and-respect-crucial-convos-for-a-profitable-partnership","wscldA01vdAjqQX8V_ooQB8yFbHMX7s3bkbqA7dLW00",[4091,4145],{"id":4092,"title":9,"body":4093,"date":7,"description":4128,"extension":318,"images":4129,"isLeader":322,"jobTitle":4131,"linkedIn":4132,"meta":4133,"name":9,"navigation":322,"path":4135,"quote":4136,"quoteCite":4137,"ref":4138,"seo":4139,"sequence":4140,"stem":4141,"team":4142,"twitter":4132,"updated":7,"website":4143,"__hash__":4144},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fkerry-guard.md",{"type":11,"value":4094,"toc":4125},[4095,4100,4108,4116,4120],[14,4096,4099],{"className":4097},[4098],"text-lg","Kerry Guard (she\u002Fher) is a mom of twins - boy and a girl. She understands what work life balance really looks like and is on a mission to build a company that honors parents having a career and a life. She’s out to prove you really can have both with policies like ensuring 20 days of vacation each year, no client emails after 6PM or weekends, unlimited sick days, and everyday flexibility.",[14,4101,4102,4103,4107],{},"She also hosts our podcast, ",[206,4104,4106],{"href":4105},"\u002Fpodcasts\u002Fmarketing-leaders\u002F","Back on T-R-A-C-K",", which brings eight digital marketing experts to your ears every quarter.",[14,4109,4110,4111,4115],{},"Kerry is responsible for HR. If you’d like to join MKG where people are first and your expertise matter, Kerry will be with you through the entire interview process ensuring each candidate meets the necessary requirements and gets a fair shot. Want to join MKG and Kerry’s mission of bringing People First to as many people as possible? Check out our ",[206,4112,4114],{"href":4113},"\u002Fabout\u002Fjobs\u002F","Jobs page"," and see if we have a position right for you!",[81,4117,4119],{"id":4118},"fun-facts","Fun facts",[46,4121,4122],{},[49,4123,4124],{},"Kerry now lives in Guernsey — a tiny nook in the world between England and France. Come visit for a spot of tea any time!",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4126},[4127],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},"Meet Kerry Guard, one of MKG Marketing’s founders. 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Moman Rawden",{"type":11,"value":4772,"toc":4799},[4773,4777,4780,4783,4786,4788],[14,4774,4776],{"className":4775},[4098],"Alanna graduated from the University of Alabama in 2004. She started her career at an advertising agency in Birmingham, AL, and has spent most of her career in Account Leadership roles working on consumer brands like Verizon Wireless, Books-A-Million, Toys ‘R’ Us, and Hard Rock Hotel & Casinos. In 2015, she left the agency world with a desire to gain more digital advertising experience, which led to her running a one-person digital department for a regional credit union.",[14,4778,4779],{},"Account Direction has always been a natural fit for Alanna because she enjoys managing projects, big picture strategy, and building relationships. She chose to come back to the agency world when she learned about MKG and our People First values.",[14,4781,4782],{},"She is most proud of the impact she had on her previous company by creating a positive and supportive environment for those she managed. ",[14,4784,4785],{},"Alanna enjoys spending time with her husband and two teenage daughters, has a very eclectic taste in music, and is an obsessive Hamilfan.",[81,4787,4119],{"id":4118},[46,4789,4790,4793,4796],{},[49,4791,4792],{},"In college, she won a radio contest for her youngest brother to have dinner with Nickelback. The band spent the entire evening trying to convince her, then 15-year-old, brother to drop out of school.",[49,4794,4795],{},"She once spent 3 hours convincing a famous country singer to get off his tour bus to shoot a commercial that her client had contracted him to be in.",[49,4797,4798],{},"Her family is a big fan of True Crime, and they binge Crime Junkie on every road trip.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4800},[4801],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},"Meet Alanna Moman-Rawden, one of MKG Marketing’s amazing Account Directors, bringing 15+ years of account leadership and direction to the table.",{"landscape":4804},"alanna-moman-rawden.webp","Director, People & Culture","alanna-moman-rawden",{},"Alanna Moman-Rawden","\u002Fteam\u002Falanna-moman-rawden","I am the one thing in life I can control. I am inimitable. I am an original.","Aaron Burr, Hamilton",{"description":4802},"team\u002Falanna-moman-rawden","WPmQvGfbA7GjEpvcVEps9YUFm4Ihb7jAlxEbp7tr3IA",{"id":4816,"title":4817,"body":4818,"date":7,"description":4857,"extension":318,"images":4858,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":4860,"linkedIn":4861,"meta":4862,"name":4817,"navigation":322,"path":4863,"quote":7,"quoteCite":4811,"ref":4864,"seo":4865,"sequence":4866,"stem":4867,"team":4860,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":4868},"team\u002Fteam\u002Falicia-antonow.md","Alicia Antonow",{"type":11,"value":4819,"toc":4855},[4820,4825,4828,4833,4836,4841,4844,4849,4852],[14,4821,4822],{},[52,4823,4824],{},"How I Got Into Digital Advertising",[14,4826,4827],{},"With a background as a nurse, my journey into digital advertising began unexpectedly when I back to Ann Arbor, Michigan. A Google Partner approached me to assist with healthcare content and ads. I quickly discovered a passion for the field, and with Google Ads sales training followed by SEM training, I was hooked.",[14,4829,4830],{},[52,4831,4832],{},"What I Love About Paid Search",[14,4834,4835],{},"Every campaign is like a unique puzzle, even within the same industry. Variations in geography, audiences, and keywords make each project different. I enjoy leveraging the full suite of Google products—Search, Display, Demand Gen, and YouTube—because they work best when integrated. The ever-evolving nature of the work keeps me inspired and challenged.",[14,4837,4838],{},[52,4839,4840],{},"Why I Chose MKG Marketing",[14,4842,4843],{},"I was drawn to MKG Marketing for its people-first culture. The company recognizes that we are all human, with lives outside of work, and fosters a supportive environment that values balance and well-being.",[14,4845,4846],{},[52,4847,4848],{},"Fun Facts About Me",[14,4850,4851],{},"I’m an avid traveler and love immersing myself in different cultures. Before having kids, my husband and I spent at least three months each year exploring the world.",[14,4853,4854],{},"I take cooking classes with locals wherever I go and love scuba diving whenever there’s water nearby.\nMy kids are my world—seeing their faces light up when experiencing something new brings me the greatest joy.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4856},[],"Meet Alicia Antonow, one of MKG Marketing’s saavy digital ads experts, bringing 15+ years of hands on execution and strategy to the table.",{"landscape":4859},"alicia-antonow.webp","Digital Advertising Experts","alicia-a-36459bb5",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Falicia-antonow","alicia-antonow",{"description":4857},54,"team\u002Falicia-antonow","dX6MgSjdInEGV2mLfl0Uv4cjJ2Si5idzNXLe33_xMZY",{"id":4870,"title":4871,"body":4872,"date":7,"description":4903,"extension":318,"images":4904,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":4906,"linkedIn":4907,"meta":4908,"name":4871,"navigation":322,"path":4909,"quote":7,"quoteCite":7,"ref":4910,"seo":4911,"sequence":4912,"stem":4913,"team":4914,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":4915},"team\u002Fteam\u002Favery-davis.md","Avery Davis",{"type":11,"value":4873,"toc":4900},[4874,4878,4881,4884,4887,4889],[14,4875,4877],{"className":4876},[4098],"\nAvery began his digital marketing career at a tech startup focused on ID scanning and facial recognition software. In addition to gaining a deep understanding of paid media and analytics, this peaked his interest in cybersecurity and tech in general. He then transitioned to agency life where he specialized in SaaS marketing.\n",[14,4879,4880],{},"Over the years, Avery has touched a variety of verticals including health and beauty, eCommerce, medical\u002Fpharma, education, and more. He is drawn to agency life because of the variety of clients he is able to work with and, in turn, learn from.",[14,4882,4883],{},"Although he’s touched several areas of digital marketing, Avery feels most at home when doing Account\u002F Project Management as well as Copywriting.",[14,4885,4886],{},"As is the theme with many of our staff, Avery was drawn to MKG because of our culture. In Avery’s words “MKG shares the same values as I do in both my professional and my personal life. When I saw that we meshed so well, this was an opportunity I couldn’t refuse!”",[81,4888,4119],{"id":4118},[46,4890,4891,4894,4897],{},[49,4892,4893],{},"Avery is an avid racquetball player. Having first gotten into the sport in college, he’s had lots of fun playing over the years. He tries to get to the court at least once a week.",[49,4895,4896],{},"Avery is a hobby bartender and enjoys making, tasting, and learning about different drinks. He’s mainly a Kentucky bourbon guy but also loves Japanese whisky!",[49,4898,4899],{},"Avery is a black belt in Pasaryu. This is a Korean mixed martial art which includes karate, kung fu, and Taekwondo. He has also trained and competed with weapons: nunchucks and samurai sword just to name a couple!",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4901},[4902],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},"Avery Davis is an Account Superivor here at MKG Marketing.",{"landscape":4905},"avery-davis.webp","Account Supervisor","avery-davis-114055191",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Favery-davis","avery-davis",{"description":4903},59,"team\u002Favery-davis","Account Services","ysXkJK5t3F27trCgdjC7IRHXNs-Qxp9YxjH9QT3gDqQ",{"id":4917,"title":4918,"body":4919,"date":7,"description":4949,"extension":318,"images":4950,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":4952,"linkedIn":4953,"meta":4954,"name":4918,"navigation":322,"path":4955,"quote":4956,"quoteCite":4957,"ref":4958,"seo":4959,"sequence":4960,"stem":4961,"team":4962,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":4963},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fjared-gerling.md","Jared Gerling",{"type":11,"value":4920,"toc":4947},[4921,4924,4927,4930,4933,4936],[14,4922,4923],{},"Jared's journey into digital marketing started with answering a classified ad for a company looking for people with writing backgrounds for a position in SEO. As a graduate of Michigan State University with a degree in Creative Writing, this sounded like the perfect opportunity.",[14,4925,4926],{},"This small agency taught him SEO from the ground up, and, after taking a break from digital marketing to receive his MA from DePaul University, Jared jumped back into the field at a medium-sized agency out of Chicago as an SEO analyst.",[14,4928,4929],{},"Since then, Jared has worked for large and small marketing agencies for over a decade, providing expert SEO services in almost every industry that has a website on the internet. And with his background in writing, Jared feels most at home in the content and customer facing side of SEO and digital marketing.",[14,4931,4932],{},"It was first and foremost the people that drew Jared to MKG. Everyone at MKG has been so in tune with his values and his personality, and they've made his time at MKG easily the best experience of his career.",[14,4934,4935],{},"Fun Facts:",[46,4937,4938,4941,4944],{},[49,4939,4940],{},"I love to travel with my wife. We've been to many incredible places over the years, and are always on the lookout for our next destination.",[49,4942,4943],{},"I was a college rower in my younger days. I rowed mostly eights as a port, and competed against some of the best schools in the nation...and lost to most of them.",[49,4945,4946],{},"I love a really good French Martini.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4948},[],"Meet Jared Gerling, one of MKG Marketing’s thoughtful SEO Experts, bringing 10+ years of experience, intentionality, and creativity to the team.",{"landscape":4951},"jared-gerling.webp","SEO Expert","jaredgerling",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fjared-gerling","The truth is, most of us discover where we are heading when we arrive.","Calvin (Calvin and Hobbes)","jared-gerling",{"description":4949},55,"team\u002Fjared-gerling","SEO Experts","1TbRdjbaY8GvD4YbpM3Pm85IGECKXrMtdVY8OquXFkg",{"id":4965,"title":4966,"body":4967,"date":7,"description":5001,"extension":318,"images":5002,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5004,"linkedIn":7,"meta":5005,"name":5007,"navigation":322,"path":5008,"quote":7,"quoteCite":7,"ref":5009,"seo":5010,"sequence":5011,"stem":5012,"team":7,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5013},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fkathy-obrien.md","Kathy Obrien",{"type":11,"value":4968,"toc":4998},[4969,4973,4976,4982,4985,4987],[14,4970,4972],{"className":4971},[4098],"\nKathy loves details and has managed the finer details of business her entire career.  She started her career in Center City, Philadelphia working for several law firms.  After she was married and had her first son, she left the bustling city to work closer to home at an international publishing company.  In 1994, Kathy and her husband Bill moved with their two sons to Charlotte, North Carolina.  They eventually completed their family with two more boys born in Charlotte.\n",[14,4974,4975],{},"In 2000 they relocated to Chester County, a suburb of Philadelphia. After a hiatus and four sons, Kathy returned to work in Chester County. This time, she gave retail a whirl so that she could be home when her school age boys were home. She quickly found out Ann Taylor was employing one of their best customers. Kathy then spent the following 10+ years in the Non-Profit arena where she did whatever needed to be done to further the mission. No job was too big, small, or unimportant to tackle.",[4977,4978,4979],"blockquote",{},[14,4980,4981],{},"Be faithful in small things because it is in them that your strength lies.\nMother Teresa",[14,4983,4984],{},"By February 2020, Kathy was eager to build something for herself and her family. She set off on a new adventure of starting her own business when she was connected with Kerry, Mike, and MKG. Having commuted and worked outside of the home for 10+ years, she was ready to work from home and have a better life balance. She followed the rainbow and found MKG in her pot of gold. MKG is like no other firm or organization for which Kathy has worked. Their standard of people first is evident in every team member, every decision, every meeting, every interaction. They live their standard.",[81,4986,4119],{"id":4118},[46,4988,4989,4992,4995],{},[49,4990,4991],{},"Kathy’s dislikes: fruit & chocolate together and Tuesday.",[49,4993,4994],{},"Family: Kathy met her husband Bill in Wildwood, New Jersey after their high school graduations during “Senior Week”. They have 4 sons and 2 grandsons. There hasn’t been a girl born in the O’Brien family in 32 years! You will often hear Kathy saying her boys are the best 4 gifts she’s ever been given.",[49,4996,4997],{},"Special talent: Baking. Her boys’ (Bill included) favorites are Spritz Cookies and Chocolate Chip Cookies. There is a running family debate as to whether Ricotta Cookies are cookies or biscuits. At Christmas time, Kathy has been known to hide cookies to save some for guests.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":4999},[5000],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},"Meet Kathy O’Brien, MKG Marketing’s amazing executive assistant who consistently supports all of MKG across the many needs of the company.",{"landscape":5003},"kathy-obrien.webp","Executive Assistant",{"imageDescription":5006},"Kathy O’Brien, MKG Marketing’s Executive Assistant, in front of a gray background | MKG Marketing","Kathy O'Brien","\u002Fteam\u002Fkathy-obrien","kathy-obrien",{"description":5001},80,"team\u002Fkathy-obrien","lRwZA7wCSBsHC6ufODo6kKfYgfp9Nf-RTYoTK1zEMo0",{"id":4092,"title":9,"body":5015,"date":7,"description":4128,"extension":318,"images":5037,"isLeader":322,"jobTitle":4131,"linkedIn":4132,"meta":5038,"name":9,"navigation":322,"path":4135,"quote":4136,"quoteCite":4137,"ref":4138,"seo":5039,"sequence":4140,"stem":4141,"team":4142,"twitter":4132,"updated":7,"website":4143,"__hash__":4144},{"type":11,"value":5016,"toc":5034},[5017,5020,5024,5028,5030],[14,5018,4099],{"className":5019},[4098],[14,5021,4102,5022,4107],{},[206,5023,4106],{"href":4105},[14,5025,4110,5026,4115],{},[206,5027,4114],{"href":4113},[81,5029,4119],{"id":4118},[46,5031,5032],{},[49,5033,4124],{},{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5035},[5036],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},{"landscape":4130},{"imageDescription":4134},{"description":4128},{"id":5041,"title":5042,"body":5043,"date":7,"description":5076,"extension":318,"images":5077,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5079,"linkedIn":5080,"meta":5081,"name":5042,"navigation":322,"path":5082,"quote":7,"quoteCite":7,"ref":5083,"seo":5084,"sequence":5085,"stem":5086,"team":4860,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5087},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fleigh-snyder.md","Leigh Snyder",{"type":11,"value":5044,"toc":5073},[5045,5049,5052,5055,5058,5061,5064,5067,5070],[14,5046,5048],{"className":5047},[4098],"\nLeigh has over 15 years of experience of managing Paid Search campaigns. She started her career at Solid Cactus, a full service eCommerce agency in Wilkes Barre Pennsylvania. Having no experience in Paid Search, she learned as she went, starting out in the earlier days of Google Adwords, when Adwords Editor wasn't even being used yet.\n",[14,5050,5051],{},"Leigh loves to create accounts and watch them grow, even more she loves to take a poorly performing account and turn it around. Watching the KPIs increase from changes she has made or new ideas she implements, keeps her career exciting.",[14,5053,5054],{},"Managing a wide variety of accounts that include local car dealerships, worldwide clothing stores, online supplement shops to plastic surgeons and much much more, Leigh brings a vast knowledge of creative ways in managing accounts.",[14,5056,5057],{},"While working the majority of her career in local offices, the options for expanding her career were becoming less and less. She decided to apply for a remote job (before it was the norm) and was able to get experience that wasn't as prevalent in the smaller area in which she resides.",[14,5059,5060],{},"After working from home for the past 6 years the opportunities kept coming and when MKG reached out to her, she knew that there was something special about them and decided to take the leap. The people first environment is not just talked about here, but it is practiced everyday. MKG Marketing is unlike anywhere she has ever worked.",[14,5062,5063],{},"Outside of work, Leigh enjoys spending time with her husband Dustin, their blended family (Emma, Casey, Jake & Brayden) and their dog Millie.",[14,5065,5066],{},"The kitchen is where you will always find her, she loves to cook and bake all things Gluten Free and no one ever knows. When they are not at a swim meet or a baseball game they love swimming in their pool, long walks on the local trails, renovating their house and binging shows.",[81,5068,5069],{"id":4118},"Fun Facts",[14,5071,5072],{},"Although it was just was a short time, at age 19 Leigh drove cross country from a small town in PA and moved to Hollywood Hills, CA. Her view from her kitchen window was the Hollywood sign. Not a bad first apartment.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5074},[5075],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":5069},"Meet Leigh Snyder, one of MKG Marketing’s amazing digital advertising experts, bringing 15 plus years of experience to the team",{"landscape":5078},"leigh-snyder.webp","Digital Advertising Expert","leighasnyder",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fleigh-snyder","leigh-snyder",{"description":5076},50,"team\u002Fleigh-snyder","tY2JnqulQK9AU4TGRfATRnob3Thk9e9yAPu6iKBPA_s",{"id":5089,"title":5090,"body":5091,"date":7,"description":5138,"extension":318,"images":5139,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5141,"linkedIn":5142,"meta":5143,"name":5090,"navigation":322,"path":5145,"quote":5146,"quoteCite":5090,"ref":5142,"seo":5147,"sequence":321,"stem":5148,"team":7,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5149},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fceleste-jacroux.md","Celeste Jacroux",{"type":11,"value":5092,"toc":5135},[5093,5101,5104,5111,5115],[14,5094,5096,5097,5100],{"className":5095},[4098],"\nCeleste Jacroux is a Go-to-Market architect for companies ready to graduate from \"random acts of marketing\" to a predictable revenue engine. As the Founder of ",[52,5098,5099],{},"Swell Marketing Advisors"," and a strategic partner to MKG, she brings deep expertise in aligning product, sales, and marketing into a cohesive GTM strategy.",[14,5102,5103],{},"Celeste understands that for founders, the hardest phase is often bridging the gap between a great product and the market that needs it. She specializes in clarifying positioning, defining ideal customer profiles (ICPs), and building the strategic roadmap that turns vision into traction.",[14,5105,5106,5107,5110],{},"At MKG, Celeste steps in as a Marketing Leader for our ",[52,5108,5109],{},"Marketing Leadership + Activation"," clients. She provides the senior-level direction and GTM rigor, working hand-in-hand with MKG’s activation teams to ensure that strategy doesn't just sit in a deck—it gets executed, measured, and optimized for growth.",[81,5112,5114],{"id":5113},"expertise","Expertise",[46,5116,5117,5123,5129],{},[49,5118,5119,5122],{},[52,5120,5121],{},"Go-to-Market Strategy:"," Launching new products and entering new markets with precision.",[49,5124,5125,5128],{},[52,5126,5127],{},"Positioning & Messaging:"," Translating complex tech into clear customer value.",[49,5130,5131,5134],{},[52,5132,5133],{},"Sales & Marketing Alignment:"," Ensuring the revenue team is fighting the same battle.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5136},[5137],{"id":5113,"depth":297,"text":5114},"Meet Celeste Jacroux, a strategic GTM partner to MKG and Founder of Sweel Marketing Advisors. She leads Go-to-Market strategy for high-growth companies.",{"landscape":5140},"celeste-jacroux.webp","Fractional GTM Leader | Founder, Swell Marketing Advisors","celeste-jacroux",{"imageDescription":5144},"Celeste Jacroux, Founder of Swell Marketing Advisors and MKG Partner","\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fceleste-jacroux","A great product doesn't win on its own. It wins when the story, the strategy, and the sales motion all pull in the exact same direction.",{"description":5138},"team\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fceleste-jacroux","xCdtcFdNV4sp78oidUDMCvxluqrG5iEdRJkxxEAOYq0",{"id":5151,"title":9,"body":5152,"date":7,"description":5199,"extension":318,"images":5200,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5201,"linkedIn":4132,"meta":5202,"name":9,"navigation":322,"path":5203,"quote":4136,"quoteCite":4137,"ref":4138,"seo":5204,"sequence":5205,"stem":5206,"team":7,"twitter":4132,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5207},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fkerry-guard.md",{"type":11,"value":5153,"toc":5196},[5154,5158,5181,5187,5190,5192],[14,5155,5157],{"className":5156},[4098],"\nKerry Guard (she\u002Fher) is the strategist founders call when they are tired of guessing. As the CEO of MKG Marketing, she doesn’t just run the agency; she steps into the trenches with clients as a Fractional Marketing Leader. She specializes in helping founders navigate the \"Growth Valley\"—building the systems, strategy, and teams required to scale from traction to expansion.",[14,5159,5160,5161,5164,5165,5168,5169,5172,5173,5176,5177,5180],{},"Her recent work focuses on bringing enterprise-level rigor to growing businesses. She serves as the strategic marketing engine for a diverse portfolio, including ",[52,5162,5163],{},"Rutkowski Law Firm",", ",[52,5166,5167],{},"Fulcrum Enterprise Group",", and ",[52,5170,5171],{},"Premier Office Movers",", where she aligns revenue goals with marketing execution. Whether she is translating complex tech into a go-to-market narrative for ",[52,5174,5175],{},"Avalanche Fusion",", or helping ",[52,5178,5179],{},"Extraordinary Advisors"," amplify their message, Kerry brings clarity and momentum to every leadership team she joins.",[14,5182,5183,5184,5186],{},"She is also the host of ",[206,5185,4106],{"href":4105},", where she interviews CMOs and Founders to uncover the human stories behind high-growth companies.",[14,5188,5189],{},"Kerry proves that high performance doesn't require burnout. As a mom of twins, she built MKG on a \"People First\" methodology—championing policies like 20 vacation days and zero after-hours emails—because she knows that rested, respected experts drive the best ROI.",[81,5191,4119],{"id":4118},[46,5193,5194],{},[49,5195,4124],{},{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5197},[5198],{"id":4118,"depth":297,"text":4119},"Meet Kerry Guard, MKG Marketing’s CEO and Principal Strategist. She works directly with founders to build scalable marketing engines while hosting the podcast, Back on T-R-A-C-K.",{"landscape":4130},"Fractional Marketing Leaders",{"imageDescription":4134},"\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fkerry-guard",{"description":5199},5,"team\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Fkerry-guard","oOXvRk_JAfbvrAQoDmPize2X6zquuQG1YD5msODvKcE",{"id":5209,"title":5210,"body":5211,"date":7,"description":5262,"extension":318,"images":5263,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5265,"linkedIn":5266,"meta":5267,"name":5269,"navigation":322,"path":5270,"quote":5271,"quoteCite":5269,"ref":5266,"seo":5272,"sequence":586,"stem":5273,"team":7,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5274},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Flaura-mcaliley.md","Laura Mcaliley",{"type":11,"value":5212,"toc":5259},[5213,5217,5228,5231,5237,5239],[14,5214,5216],{"className":5215},[4098],"\nLaura McAliley is the growth strategist founders call when they are ready to turn early traction into sustainable momentum. As the Founder of Pebble Marketing and a key Marketing Leadership partner for MKG, Laura bridges the gap between high-level vision and the gritty execution required to scale.",[14,5218,5219,5220,5223,5224,5227],{},"Her track record speaks the language of investors and boards. She has successfully scaled SaaS startups from seed stage through to exit, most notably orchestrating a ",[52,5221,5222],{},"3x revenue lift"," at ",[52,5225,5226],{},"Security Journey"," that led to a successful acquisition.",[14,5229,5230],{},"Laura thrives in the \"messy middle\" of growth. Whether she is navigating the complexities of a Fortune 100 account or launching a scrappy go-to-market strategy for a new startup, her approach is the same: build the brand, unlock the revenue, and get the business investor-ready.",[14,5232,5233,5234,5236],{},"At MKG, Laura acts as a Fractional CMO for our ",[52,5235,5109],{}," clients, bringing the senior firepower needed to professionalize your marketing function without the full-time executive headcount.",[81,5238,5114],{"id":5113},[46,5240,5241,5247,5253],{},[49,5242,5243,5246],{},[52,5244,5245],{},"SaaS Scaling:"," From Seed to Exit",[49,5248,5249,5252],{},[52,5250,5251],{},"Revenue Operations:"," Aligning marketing spend with sales outcomes",[49,5254,5255,5258],{},[52,5256,5257],{},"Brand Strategy:"," Positioning startups for acquisition and investment",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5260},[5261],{"id":5113,"depth":297,"text":5114},"Meet Laura McAliley, a strategic partner to MKG and Founder of Pebble Marketing. She serves as a Fractional CMO, helping founders scale from seed to exit.",{"landscape":5264},"laura-mcaliley.webp","Fractional CMO | Founder, Pebble Marketing","laura-mcaliley",{"imageDescription":5268},"Laura McAliley, Fractional CMO and Founder of Pebble Marketing","Laura McAliley","\u002Fteam\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Flaura-mcaliley","Founders don't need another slide deck. They need a roadmap to revenue and a partner willing to get their hands dirty to build it.",{"description":5262},"team\u002Fmarketing-leadership\u002Flaura-mcaliley","ke5GsAQwur6LBbt6guZUCgKQT6MJJm8UL5XCaXjVnZM",{"id":4146,"title":1474,"body":5276,"date":7,"description":4175,"extension":318,"images":5297,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":4179,"linkedIn":4180,"meta":5298,"name":1474,"navigation":322,"path":4183,"quote":4184,"quoteCite":4185,"ref":4186,"seo":5299,"sequence":4188,"stem":4189,"team":7,"twitter":4180,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":4190},{"type":11,"value":5277,"toc":5295},[5278,5281,5283,5285],[14,5279,4152],{"className":5280},[4098],[14,5282,4155],{},[14,5284,4158],{},[46,5286,5287,5289,5291,5293],{},[49,5288,4163],{},[49,5290,4166],{},[49,5292,4169],{},[49,5294,4172],{},{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5296},[],{"landscape":4177},{"imageDescription":4182},{"description":4175},{"id":5301,"title":5302,"body":5303,"date":7,"description":5323,"extension":318,"images":5324,"isLeader":322,"jobTitle":5326,"linkedIn":5327,"meta":5328,"name":5302,"navigation":322,"path":5329,"quote":5330,"quoteCite":5331,"ref":5327,"seo":5332,"sequence":5333,"stem":5334,"team":5335,"twitter":5336,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5337},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fnathan-stenberg.md","Nathan Stenberg",{"type":11,"value":5304,"toc":5321},[5305,5309,5312,5315,5318],[14,5306,5308],{"className":5307},[4098],"Our SEO Expert, Nathan, comes to MKG with an extensive background in digital marketing from front-end development to omni-channel marketing strategy.",[14,5310,5311],{},"He discovered SEO as part of a tech support job with a template website company where he was supporting clients with their websites. There he defined and developed the standards and processes that the SEO team would use for keyword research as well as the writing and implementation of the optimization. He then leveraged these standards to create an add-on subscription-based SEO product called “SEO Boost” which provided clients with a more proactive SEO service for their websites. This resulted in him providing keyword research and optimization recommendations for close to 1,500 websites during his tenure.",[14,5313,5314],{},"From there Nathan moved into the agency world, staring with a small boutique firm in Portland, OR, providing SEO audits and recommendations for clients ranging from small businesses to enterprise e-commerce companies.",[14,5316,5317],{},"He then moved to a larger agency and, once again, developed the SEO Team processes as the agency transitioned from an email-focused agency to a full-service digital marketing agency. During this time, Nathan was able to explore different areas of digital marketing strategy and really developed an understanding and passion for omni-channel marketing.",[14,5319,5320],{},"When Nathan is not working, he enjoys spending time with his partner and two children. You can find him playing casual sports, music, and Overwatch as well as snowboarding and cooking.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5322},[],"Meet Nathan Stenberg, one of MKG Marketing’s Digital Marketing Strategist, with an extensive background in digital marketing from front-end development to omni-channel strategy. ",{"landscape":5325},"nathan-stenberg.webp","Director, Strategy","nathan-stenberg",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fnathan-stenberg","Repetition is the path to mastery.","Zenyatta",{"description":5323},4,"team\u002Fnathan-stenberg","Marketing Strategists","natestenberg23","1moy0e42nEoQgH0weNaASdQ6FTDWXwC5TDftv5YS3tU",{"id":5339,"title":5340,"body":5341,"date":7,"description":5369,"extension":318,"images":5370,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5079,"linkedIn":5372,"meta":5373,"name":5340,"navigation":322,"path":5374,"quote":5375,"quoteCite":4137,"ref":5376,"seo":5377,"sequence":5378,"stem":5379,"team":4860,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5380},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fnick-bare.md","Nick Bare",{"type":11,"value":5342,"toc":5367},[5343,5347,5350,5353,5356],[14,5344,5346],{"className":5345},[4098],"Nick Bare's college offered a digital technology and culture degree and heI ended up taking some communications and marketing classes as well and liked the thought of them all lining up with each other. Once he graduated, he landed a role in paid search and has been doing it for nine+ years now.",[14,5348,5349],{},"He loves that there's always a challenge to tackle. He enjoys taking on new accounts and getting into the weeds to see what can help them turn around and start driving more efficient leads.",[14,5351,5352],{},"He's most proud of being a dad.",[14,5354,5355],{},"Interesting facts:",[46,5357,5358,5361,5364],{},[49,5359,5360],{},"Born with a cleft lip and palate and has had seven surgeries in his life",[49,5362,5363],{},"Watched the Seahawks win Super Bowl 48 with his dad in New York",[49,5365,5366],{},"Travels around the country to visit all the MLB stadiums with his son",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5368},[],"Meet Nick Bare, one of MKG Marketing’s Digital Advertising Expert, bringing 15 plus years of experience to the team. ",{"landscape":5371},"nick-bare.webp","nickbare",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fnick-bare","We can choose courage or we can choose comfort, but we can't have both.","nick-bare",{"description":5369},52,"team\u002Fnick-bare","yVusNcEIbiAvdPE02qyDKE_aINcQ0QMXSeyOKv9x5PE",{"id":5382,"title":5383,"body":5384,"date":7,"description":5369,"extension":318,"images":5411,"isLeader":4178,"jobTitle":5413,"linkedIn":5414,"meta":5415,"name":5383,"navigation":322,"path":5416,"quote":5417,"quoteCite":5418,"ref":5419,"seo":5420,"sequence":5421,"stem":5422,"team":5423,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5424},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fprachi-sarin.md","Prachi Sarin",{"type":11,"value":5385,"toc":5409},[5386,5389,5392,5395],[14,5387,5388],{},"Prachi has worked in marketing for over 10 years across various industries, but digital marketing has always been her true interest. She finally got the opportunity to pursue it when she moved to the United States and joined MKG as an apprentice, embarking on her digital marketing journey.​",[14,5390,5391],{},"Why I Joined MKG Marketing:\nI joined MKG Marketing because of its people-first culture, transparency, and commitment to growth. It’s a place where I can learn, contribute, and work with a team that genuinely cares.",[14,5393,5394],{},"Fun Facts About Me:",[46,5396,5397,5400,5403,5406],{},[49,5398,5399],{},"I love to read detective, thriller, and mystery books and watch shows in the same genre.",[49,5401,5402],{},"I’m a mom to twin girls—they are my world! Watching them grow, learn, and explore life brings me joy.",[49,5404,5405],{},"I love cooking for my family. It started with my husband, who’s a foodie, and now we cook together for our daughters.",[49,5407,5408],{},"Our family also enjoys playing video games—it’s our way to unwind and have fun together.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5410},[],{"landscape":5412},"prachi-sarin.webp","Digital Marketing Coordinator","prachisarin",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fprachi-sarin","We keep moving forward, opening new doors, and doing new things because we're curious, and curiosity keeps leading us down new paths.","Walt Disney","prachi-sarin",{"description":5369},75,"team\u002Fprachi-sarin","Digital Marketing","LjXpVTmZn-XwzExAyq2igbw_fHhrVcf4nOLoEmURbEQ",{"id":5426,"title":5427,"body":5428,"date":7,"description":5442,"extension":318,"images":5443,"isLeader":322,"jobTitle":5445,"linkedIn":5446,"meta":5447,"name":5427,"navigation":322,"path":5448,"quote":5449,"quoteCite":5450,"ref":5451,"seo":5452,"sequence":291,"stem":5453,"team":4142,"twitter":7,"updated":7,"website":7,"__hash__":5454},"team\u002Fteam\u002Fsam-ellsworth.md","Sam Ellsworth",{"type":11,"value":5429,"toc":5440},[5430,5434,5437],[14,5431,5433],{"className":5432},[4098],"Sam has over 15 years of experience managing the development of marketing campaigns for national and global brands. She started her career in San Francisco, working in account management at ad agencies, where she managed a range of successful marketing campaigns from Super Bowl TV spots and fully-integrated product launches to social media campaigns and events.",[14,5435,5436],{},"After 12 years in San Francisco, Sam and her husband decided it was time to leave the big city and find a slower pace of life, settling down outside of Burlington, Vermont. Sam spent her first couple years in Vermont working remotely for a San Francisco agency and then as the Marketing Director at a local craft brewery before joining the MKG team. She was drawn to MKG due to our people first value and the opportunity to get to focus on a few specific, results driven marketing tactics.",[14,5438,5439],{},"Outside of work, Sam spends her time with her husband, 4-year-old daughter and chocolate lab exploring Vermont and all it has to offer — from hiking, skiing and enjoying all the local food to growing their backyard garden and working on a never-ending list of house renovations.",{"title":77,"searchDepth":291,"depth":291,"links":5441},[],"Meet Sam Ellsworth, one of MKG Marketing’s amazing Account Directors, who brings over 15 years experience managing marketing campaign development. ",{"landscape":5444},"sam-ellsworth.webp","Director, Client Services","samantha-ellsworth-40875866",{},"\u002Fteam\u002Fsam-ellsworth","Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple.","Dr. Seuss","sam-ellsworth",{"description":5442},"team\u002Fsam-ellsworth","Xb0ljkUHaVzTObdBxfiOxIpE5jcK9HSfgiMlBhd8fuc",1787835212714]